Is neccesary to replace the brake fluid at 20k? - Page 3 - Smart Car of America Forums : Smart Car Forum
Home News Models Alternatives
 
Smart Car of America - America's Largest Smart Fortwo Enthusiast Community   Smart Fortwo, smart car, smartcar
HOME FORUMS GALLERY

Go Back   Smart Car of America Forums : Smart Car Forum > Technical > smart Operation and Maintenance


Notices

SmartCarofAmerica.com is the premier Smart Car Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
» Auto Insurance
» Supporting Partner
» Recent Threads
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-10-2009, 09:32 PM   #21 (permalink)
 
Smart_Dude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Round Rock, TX
Drive: Cabrio
Posts: 57
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by John_H View Post
The great thing I learned from this thread is that it's the copper ions (from typically copper brake lines) that causes the pitting in the iron components. Not water!
I bow to information presented. However, water vapor does play a role, albeit not the only role, in brake component deterioration.

Cheers,
Jeff

Smart_Dude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 09:50 PM   #22 (permalink)
Moderator
SCOA Club
 
jimvw57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: southern Minnesota
Drive: Pure
Posts: 4,845
Thanks: 75
Thanked 356 Times in 239 Posts
Garage
Brake fluid in an open container will absorb moisture. In a closed system, it shouldn't absorb water. Since most systems get opened and fluid added as the pads and/ or shoes wear, when they are replaced. many mechanics just force the pistons in without removing the extra fluid. this causes the seal on the master cylinder to be damaged as the excess fluid finds somewhere to go. The result: water vapor can enter the system.

Most cars and trucks use Steel brake lines as Copper lines can't take as much pressure Steel can handle more heat than copper lines too.
jimvw57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 10:04 PM   #23 (permalink)
JOIN SCOA.YOU'LL BE GLAD
SCOA Club
 
jetfuel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: padded room #1
Drive: Brabus
Posts: 6,702
Thanks: 191
Thanked 303 Times in 182 Posts
...not so fast Jim...
Current double-wrapped, brazed and coated steel tubing is susceptible to brazing voids, coating voids, poor coating adhesion and discontinuities. These susceptibilities, combined with random service damage, mean the actual service life of the brake tube materials presently used in U.S.-manufactured vehicles should be considered unacceptable.

...trailer test results demonstrate that 90-10 coppernickel tube is a significantly better choice for automotive brake lines than low-carbon steel .

jetfuel
jetfuel is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 10:06 PM   #24 (permalink)
 
John_H's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Roanoke, VA
Drive: Cabrio
Posts: 3,546
Thanks: 0
Thanked 12 Times in 8 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimvw57 View Post
Most cars and trucks use Steel brake lines as Copper lines can't take as much pressure Steel can handle more heat than copper lines too.
But the steel cables are copper lined, aren't they? From the first link in reply #8:
Quote:
The inside surface of the brake lines is coated with a copper brazing alloy
I haven't made, spec'ed, or researched brake lines so I don't know the variety available.
John_H is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 10:13 PM   #25 (permalink)
JOIN SCOA.YOU'LL BE GLAD
SCOA Club
 
jetfuel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: padded room #1
Drive: Brabus
Posts: 6,702
Thanks: 191
Thanked 303 Times in 182 Posts
For many years the tubing in automotive brake systems has been manufactured from low-carbon steel. One or more superficial coatings are applied after brazing to protect the steel substrate from corrosion, because steel has no inherent corrosion resistance to the road environment. Although coating composition has changed since the original hot-dip lead-tin coatings were used, coating flaws remain a problem. The addition of zinc-rich paints did little to improve the protection of the tube. Current aluminum-zinc coatings and added polyvinylfloride coatings are still inadequate to totally protect the steel tube.

jetfuel
jetfuel is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 10:40 PM   #26 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: GONE: A tired forum & tired car
Drive: Passion
Posts: 414
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetfuel View Post
...not so fast Jim...
Current double-wrapped, brazed and coated steel tubing is susceptible to brazing voids, coating voids, poor coating adhesion and discontinuities. These susceptibilities, combined with random service damage, mean the actual service life of the brake tube materials presently used in U.S.-manufactured vehicles should be considered unacceptable.

...trailer test results demonstrate that 90-10 coppernickel tube is a significantly better choice for automotive brake lines than low-carbon steel .

jetfuel
Credit your research source, please...
EdwardDennis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 10:43 PM   #27 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: GONE: A tired forum & tired car
Drive: Passion
Posts: 414
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetfuel View Post
For many years the tubing in automotive brake systems has been manufactured from low-carbon steel. One or more superficial coatings are applied after brazing to protect the steel substrate from corrosion, because steel has no inherent corrosion resistance to the road environment. Although coating composition has changed since the original hot-dip lead-tin coatings were used, coating flaws remain a problem. The addition of zinc-rich paints did little to improve the protection of the tube. Current aluminum-zinc coatings and added polyvinylfloride coatings are still inadequate to totally protect the steel tube.

jetfuel
Ditto..
EdwardDennis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 10:50 PM   #28 (permalink)
JOIN SCOA.YOU'LL BE GLAD
SCOA Club
 
jetfuel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: padded room #1
Drive: Brabus
Posts: 6,702
Thanks: 191
Thanked 303 Times in 182 Posts
jetfuel is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 11:13 PM   #29 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: GONE: A tired forum & tired car
Drive: Passion
Posts: 414
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Indeed, sir. Thank you.
Copyrighted work is due proper credit and acknowlegment (...or acknowledgement, for our UK members).
EdwardDennis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2009, 06:51 PM   #30 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Hampden, MA
Drive: Passion
Posts: 2,470
Thanks: 7
Thanked 13 Times in 12 Posts
I would be nice if more of the copper nickel tube was on the road. Most of the cars coming into your view are running the mild steel stuff. and rotting from inside and out.
Most of the color change is from seal residue. The C clamp in my tool box that spread pads in years gone by has a new use. Times change and having that junk in the system does no good at all.
The junk as I see it being the water raising the boiling point leading to fade and corrosion and the particulate debris that clogs the various components. whatever is in suspension in this brew getting rid of it is good and the right thing to do. I do it my my own.
karl

Last edited by Karl Roth; 07-11-2009 at 06:57 PM.
Karl Roth is offline   Reply With Quote
Today
 


This ad will not be shown if you are logged in.

Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What this car needs is.... (a windshield washer fluid indicator) jetfuel smart Modifications 45 02-18-2010 11:58 PM
Factory Washer Fluid magilly00 smart Operation and Maintenance 26 12-16-2009 08:51 AM
Best transmission (oil) for 451? torqueaholic smart Operation and Maintenance 62 10-25-2009 02:39 PM
Transmission Fluid for Smart Marco smart Operation and Maintenance 13 06-03-2009 03:10 PM
Anyone purchased smart transmission fluid? Padawan smart Operation and Maintenance 26 04-04-2009 08:31 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:24 PM.



Smart Cars of America, LLC is not affiliated with, authorized by, associated with or have any connection with G&K, Zap, Mercedes-Benz, Mercedes-Benz AMG, Mercedes-Benz McLaren Mercedes-Benz USA, LLC, smart Canada Division, DaimlerChrysler, Chrysler LLC, DaimlerChrysler AG, Maybach, smart gmbh, a division of Mercedes Benz LLC, the manufacturer of SMART automobiles, smart USA Distributor, LLC, a division of Penske Automotive Group, Inc, the exclusive authorized U.S. importer and distributor of the smart vehicle or any of their official dealerships


Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2
Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.
Ad Management by RedTyger