Stored Data?

[The Rigger]

Here's one for those of you who work in a smart dealership or are wiser in the ways of ECMs than I am (not that that's a great challenge)...

What sort of data is stored in the car's various computers, anyway? I mean, aside from the mileage. Can the car "remember" how fast you've driven over a given distance, &c.? Can it be "Big Brothered" like the OnStar system theoretically could be?

I'm in the midst of a discussion in another place regarding the Big Brother potential of things like OnStar, SkyNet, open-road tolling, and the car's own electronics.

IMWTK....

[jwight]

WTFO...

Here's the federal rule governing Event Data Recorders if installed by the manufacturer: http://nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/DOT/NHT...le_Aug2006.pdf

Also some discussion of state legislation on the use of such data: 2006 Event Data Recorder ("Black Box") Legislation

Does the smart carry an EDR? Don't know.

Note: typically these devices record only the last 30 seconds (rough estimate) of data prior to a crash; that info is used for analysis and crash reconstruction.

[JPaul]

Originally Posted by jwight

...

Does the smart carry an EDR? Don't know.

Note: typically these devices record only the last 30 seconds (rough estimate) of data prior to a crash; that info is used for analysis and crash reconstruction.

Could be, could be. "My" Dealership Parts & Maintenance Manager told me that the last few seconds are memorized...

[SuperGeek]

Page 196 and up have a list of what data elements have to be recorded in an EDR. I bet the data's already available, so recording it might not be so much of a challenge.


The big question: Does the Smart have an EDR?


Everything from speed, steering angle, brake pressure, safety system use, roll angle, ABS/ESP status, seat belt use... lots of stuff is supported if recorded.

Inquiring geeks want to know.

[jwight]

EDRs were formerly made by a company called Vertronix; they later were taken over by Bosch. Here's a list of cars the Bosch EDR software supports: http://www.boschdiagnostics.com/test..._rev_1_0_0.pdf

smart is not on the list but I'm still not certain the car does not have some type of EDR.

[JPaul]

To add to my previous post: I did ask specifically if it had a "black box". The answer was that the "computer" remembers the last seconds. Probably any input in the ECU, but not the position of the steering wheel and other data that are not electronically monitored... That was my understanding during this conversation.

[Periclaws]

Black box on board: AutoWeek Magazine

This does not mean German cars don't record and store info,just from what I understand don't tend to share the info.

[fmcdave]

As some who has designed real-time onboard computers; I can guarantee that some form of data is stored. Probably not a lot, but there are probably two varieties:

1. The data buffer used by the software to integrate various inputs into events.
2. Whatever data the designers needed to debug the software as they were developing it.

On a system I worked on, we saved the last 100 button pushes and the contents of the guidance and navigation buffers. This was not "big brother" but trying to help us figure out in-service problems.

[Smart Enuf]

You probably have less to worry about from Big Brother than you do from insurance companies and the other guy suing you in the event of a crash. EDR data have been increasingly used in negligence and wrongful death lawsuits:

EDR Case Law
(sampling of EDR case law, including some Canadian cases)

Depending on the car manufacturer, all kinds of data may be recorded prior to a crash:

Crash Data Recorders

http://www.harristechnical.com/downloads/49CFR563.pdf (Federal regulation on EDRs)

EDR State Laws
(State statutes generally governing disclosure, downloading and release of EDR data, including for vehicle repair, crash investigation and litigation purposes).

And in response to a prior post, the smart's Owner's Manual (p. 26) states that the smart does have electronic devices that can record crash events. Since this disclosure was done pursuant to California Vehicle Code section 9951, it's a safe bet that the smart does have an EDR. How many data fields it records remains an open question.

[chieftmc]

Originally Posted by Smart Enuf

You probably have less to worry about from Big Brother than you do from insurance companies and the other guy suing you in the event of a crash. EDR data have been increasingly used in negligence and wrongful death lawsuits:.....

Just because you're PARANOID does NOT mean that someone is NOT after you