The world is going to move more and more towards nuclear power. We are too. We have no choice. And more nuclear power means more electric vehicles etc. That's just the way the energy math works. Wind and solar are not going to be nearly enough to keep the economy going and more importantly agriculture (as in food production).
Last edited by Smartdavis; 02-25-2008 at 12:01 PM.
Referring to the emboldened part of your statement above, where did you ever get the idea that large scale wind was useless. Your very own state has the largest % of wind generation in the country is has an admirable record of generation capacity using clean free energy made from the large scale wind farms you have there. I am not sure of the number now, but Texas has become the benchmark (and envy) of most other states having wind resources for the amount of wind generation capacity your state has.
If you were to do some basic research on what's in your back yard, you would find this out. Please don't take offense to my post, but too many people down play the role that large wind is playing, as it evolves towards helping our country become more energy independent. This attitude was quite prevalent in our country for decades beginning in the 70's....all the smart guys ;) in the energy field proclaimed that wind power would never amount to anything. Look at how far behind that attitude has gotten us when compared to European countries that have 10 times the windpower utilization that we have and are better off for it now. We were set back by that mindset just like we were set back with ideas like the smart car and the fact that it was too small to be of any use in our commuting infrastructure....too bad, too...cause now we have to play catchup all the way around..
The argument that electricity generating plants make too much air polution to be of any good for plug in electric cars is false as well. The amount of carbon put into the atmosphere to charge one car to full charge is around 1/10th the amount that that same car will emit were it a gasoline powered car. There are some very eye opening articles on EVWorld if you wish to be enlightened about PHEV's and/or EV's....they ARE the wave of the future in propulsion in this country and the world....IMHO.
John
Yes, we do have the largest %, but I dont see them replacing coal. In fact, from what I understand they only feed the grid 15-20%. Thats not much compared to coal. What I meant by 'large scale' is that I think smaller versions installed near communities might be more efficent, or maybe individual turbines attached to houses. As far as all over europe, there are nuclear reactors all over europe also. I dont think we should get rid of wind energy, I just dont think we have the technology to harness it effectively yet (though more so than solar). As far as being the envy of the other states, we are also the most air polluted in the US. We have more polution than some small countries. I saw a special about 2 weeks ago about nuclear power and how some plants were able to use the radation from waste for electricity. Some even sell the waste to other plants who use it.
Thanks.
Last edited by jediknight36; 02-27-2008 at 09:02 AM.
Yes, we do have the largest %, but I dont see them replacing coal. In fact, from what I understand they only feed the grid 15-20%. Thats not much compared to coal. What I meant by 'large scale' is that I think smaller versions installed near communities might be more efficent, or maybe individual turbines attached to houses. As far as all over europe, there are nuclear reactors all over europe also. I dont think we should get rid of wind energy, I just dont think we have the technology to harness it effectively yet (though more so than solar). As far as being the envy of the other states, we are also the most air polluted in the US. We have more polution than some small countries. I saw a special about 2 weeks ago about nuclear power and how some plants were able to use the radation from waste for electricity. Some even sell the waste to other plants who use it.
Thanks.
Regarding the small wind turbines sized for individual homes because I had one of my very own at my home when I lived out in a rural area of Upstate NY. It was a 10 KW Bergey and it worked well at my site for 15 years. When I sold the property, believe it or not, I needed to sell the wind system outright off the property because potential property buyers were actually afraid of it and could not see the real benefit of it. (15-20,000kwhr's/year)
The smaller systems (but appropriately sized for a home) like that one are more than twice the cost/kw to purchase and erect in your back yard if bought new. Large windplants are around $1000 per kw ( I think...not exactly sure) where the smaller systems like the one I had installed in 1988 was $2500/kw...now that price is even higher.
The technology is evolving still, though, and that will drive costs down it is hoped.
no question that coal is the dirtiest fuel around and I read that Texas has alot of them. Hopefully, stack scrubbers and improved technology will make it cleaner and we can use all the coal that is available in this country.
http://epa.gov/radtown/coal-plant.html for starters then do a search about mercury pollution same place is the source our fossil fuel cars are cleaner than the fossil fuel power plants. Yes clean power can be produced we are the Saudi of coal we have a bunch of it. We need to clean up our act with its use.
karl
You could cover every square foot of open non crop land with solar arrays, and stick 600% more wind turbines in the air and still not provide more then 10~12% of the energy needs of this country at the rate of growth we have and will continue to have
Coal is abundant and easy to get to, read "cheap energy source"... there are ways to burn it and NOT pollute
Nuclear is about the least cost per KW hour for large scale distribution but we are afraid of it and the potential disposal of the waste
The sooner we accept these facts, require coal instead of OIL fired electrical plants, mandate the scrubbers, pay the slightly higher KW rate, tell the few states that have reasonable geological nuke fuel disposal sites to suck it up and get with the program...then the sooner we can get off the foreign oil tit...
That is, if we really want off that tit... from my 35 years of government/public service (mostly as a soldier)...it seems to me we want to be a major world consumer of everybody else's resources....
Just so you know, here in Texas we have a LOT of wind power and solar arrays...but geeee...darn.... When the sun don't shine (more then 50% of the time BTW) and the wind don't blow (more then 38% of the time BTW) those sources produce NADA (O- zero -GWHs) and a hydro, oil or coal fired plants must carry the loads...
About the only exception to this I know of is the multi billion $$$ battery bank in Fairbanks Alaska that can carry the grid for 18+ hours on stored energy...If you have not seen this array of batteries it is impressive...
I live out in the sticks on 3 acres with good enough wind and sun light to get off the grid... problem is I am not rich... to fully run my micro estate/ranch it would take 68 years to pay off the costs of wind, solar, and THE storage requirements.... sorry folks but at 52 I don't have that much time just to break even...Plus I don't believe in Al Gore's myth...flawed junk science
During hot summer my monthly cooling and light bill is $98~$104... deep winter chill for a few months requires wood stove and electric heat... average is $206~$265 depending on how many winter ice storm days for about 3 months... I have 4 out of 12 months that the bill is less then $80
Yes Virginia, you really can turn off all the lights and other loads and get your consumption down to reasonable.... It also helps to only pay about 16c per Kwh to your electric co-op...grin
BTW I think electric smarts a real smart... for city dwellers and those who work and visit
The sooner our major cities restrict any internal combustion vehicles the better health every one in those pollution holes will be.... I know of several European cities that do NOT allow any thing but electric cars... smell good...quiet... healthy folks... not dirty at all.... NO reason for Las Vegas to have that grungy yellow brown ugly stinking cloud over it 24/7 365....
Last edited by Fredvon4; 02-27-2008 at 10:56 AM.
Reason: add a thought
If I eat all your cookies first I still have my own. I can put up photovolactics from Home Depot or wind and use the grid as my storage device here in MA "if I had the bucks". Other states have reverse metering as well. CO2 is the product of perfect combustion. The only way to reduce it is to burn less. There are lots of other things we are doing to abuse the world we live in without getting wound up on that.
every little bit helps. No I will not ask you all to join hands an sing. We can all do a little and make some rational choices.
karl
Ma Earth, the old bag, has a way to clean and use CO2...
Slashing triple canopy jungle or rain forests to plant corn, beets, sugar cane for ethanol is just plain counter productive and stupid...
BUT hey! We all want to pretend diluting perfectly good cheap gasoline with alcohol is a good idea... harrumph! more CO2 goes into the production, less Therms of energy come out MPG averages go down and there is a net gain in pollution.... BUT hey we all feel good that mid west farmers are making a killing in the market
Sure don't help my bottom dollar very much... 2.9Billion in subsidies* last year... Thirteen poor countries deciding to grow fuel crops instead of the food they need..
*subsidies= tax dollars* *Tax Dollars= theft by government of my labor and efforts ( well it is when it is transfered from me to already greedy rich comglomerates like the ethanol growers associations)
Al Gore should be horse whipped in my not apologetic opinion.
I still think electric smart cars are smart and have a place
Last edited by Fredvon4; 02-27-2008 at 01:26 PM.
Reason: add a thought
Ma Earth, the old bag, has a way to clean and use CO2...
Slashing triple canopy jungle or rain forests to plant corn, beets, sugar cane for ethanol is just plain counter productive and stupid...
BUT hey! We all want to pretend diluting perfectly good cheap gasoline with alcohol is a good idea... harrumph! more CO2 goes into the production, less Therms of energy come out MPG averages go down and there is a net gain in pollution.... BUT hey we all feel good that mid west farmers are making a killing in the market
Sure don't help my bottom dollar very much... 2.9Billion in subsidies* last year... Thirteen poor countries deciding to grow fuel crops instead of the food they need..
*subsidies= tax dollars* *Tax Dollars= theft by government of my labor and efforts ( well it is when it is transfered from me to already greedy rich comglomerates like the ethanol growers associations)
Al Gore should be horse whipped in my not apologetic opinion.
I still think electric smart cars are smart and have a place
I heard today that most states are utilizing *E10* and perhaps not making that fact too well known by indicating such in an inconspicuous place on the gas pump. And I also heard that Mobil is one of the few petro companies that DOESN'T put even 10% ethanol in with their gasoline and that is why their price is usually alittle more than other brands. No backup to that but I will search for it. That fact may also be why the EPA changed it's mileage rankings for all cars...to reflect the crappy heat value of the *contaminant wonder fuel known as ethanol*.
And if more people understood the facts that Fred presented insofar as the "real cost" of producing ethanol in this country from corn, less people would use it. They think they are getting value from the reduced price.....HA HA. not on your life!!
The AutoGuide.com network consists of the largest network of enthusiast-owned enthusiast-operated automotive communities.
AutoGuide.com provides the latest car reviews, auto show coverage, new car prices, and automotive news. The AutoGuide network operates more than 100 automotive forums where our users consult peers for shopping information and advice, and share opinions as a community.
Big Red
R2-D2 42
Today
Linear Mode
