I, personally, don't have any dogs in this fight! I hope that the current Mitsu engine lasts a long, long time! However, having read a number of books on the smart before mine arrived, here is an excerpt from "The Smart Story" by Paul Guiness:
"One common misconception about the city-coupe - now known, of course, as the fortwo - was that it was a German car. You can forgive the assumption, bearing in mind the Mercedes parentage. In reality though, it is only the smart's engine, transmission and drivetrains that are built in Germany, at a huge hi-tech factory in Berlin. Production there started in 1997, and the whole drivetrain package is produced on site before being despatched and shipped to smart's French plant in Hambach."
This is on page 21, which shows a picture of the engines being built on the assembly line in Germany, along with this caption: "The city-coupe - now called fortwo - might be built in France, but it's three-cylinder engine comes from Germany, engineered by Mercedes-Benz."
So....... in reading this book, it makes it very clear who made the engine for the smart fortwo and where is was manufactured. As far as the various opinions on the Mitsubishi engine, I've read a lot of good reports & reviews on other Mitsu engines, so I'm hoping that the dependability & longevity hold true for OUR engines as well!
Just to clarify the point, but it's still a Suprex designed engine, modified by Mercedes engineers.
I don't care who builds it. I think it's a myth that some companies build things better than others. Normally the differences come down to specs, materials, & quality control. Give any competent manufacturing plant the same specs, same design, same materials, & same quality control and they'll turn out the same prodcut in the end.
Just to clarify the point, but it's still a Suprex designed engine, modified by Mercedes engineers.
What are you basing that statement on? Where is your information coming from? Any references? Not saying that your statement is incorrect, but a person can "state" anything they want, but if you don't have a reference ot basis for the statement, then it doesn't have much validity, IMHO!! I mean, someone could say that it was designed by VW, but that doesn't make it factual!
What are you basing that statement on? Where is your information coming from? Any references? Not saying that your statement is incorrect, but a person can "state" anything they want, but if you don't have a reference ot basis for the statement, then it doesn't have much validity, IMHO!! I mean, someone could say that it was designed by VW, but that doesn't make it factual!
There are numerous references over the past 10 years to the fact that it is a Suprex engine, some of it directly from Smart/Mercedes literature. I don't have time to pull something up right now, but if you google it, you'll find them. When I get back this evening, I'll pull some up for you.
O.K. I googled, and here's one that I found, along with a number of brochures for the 450s referencing the "Suprex Turbo Engine." Here's an article that might make it more clear. I've included an excerpt below the link.
"The Smart, designed in three years by Micro Compact Car (MCC), a joint venture between Daimler-Benz and SMH/Swatch, goes on sale in mainland Europe in spring 1998 and in the UK a year later. It defies convention in a number of ways: it carries only two passengers; is just 2.5m long - shorter than a Mini - and 1.45m wide. It weighs 680kg.
Smart's designers decided that there was no alternative to the piston engine at present. So at launch the Smart will be offered with the `Suprex' three cylinder turbocharged petrol engine developed by MCC."
So....the Suprex engine was developed by MCC, which is Micro Compact Car, which is, in essence, Mercedes/Daimler-Benz. So if they developed the engine specifically for the MCC, which later became the smart fortwo, and they're building the engine at the Berlin plant, then doesn't that, in essence, make the engine one that's built by Mercedes/Daimler-Benz??? The ones that are turbocharged are the Suprex turbocharged engines?? No? The ONLY references to Suprex engines that I can find when Googling are to the smart engines. They've even taken the Suprex Turbo Engine from the smart fortwo and used it in an airplane. No matter how I search or what comes up, the only time the term "Suprex engine" is mentioned, it is always in reference to either the MCC, or the smart fortwo. If this is a separate company, and not simply a subsidiary of Daimler-Benz, it would seem that company information could be found that is separate from Daimler-Benz. So it would seem that it's still an engine developed, designed, and built by Mercedes/Daimler-Benz, and Suprex is just the name of the subsidiary company. I find no evidence of Suprex being a completely separate company.
"4 TECHNICAL FEATURES
The Smart vehicle offers characteristics suitable for urban
transportation: small dimensions, light weight and low
consumption helping to reduce CO2 emissions.
Designed by the Suprex Company on behalf of MCC
Company, the mechanical features of this 3 cylinder-in-line
engine are: 63.5 mm bore, 63 mm stroke, 599 cc swept
volume, 9.5:1 gasoline compression ratio. The output performances
mentioned below are achieved through use of a
GT12 cooled turbocharger produced by Allied Signal
Automotive (Garrett), allowing over-boost conditions."
It is evident that in later years M-B bought into, or bought outright, the original independant Suprex Company as they eventually did with Ilmor (UK). SUPREX (all caps) is now an international registered trademark of Daimler AG Intellectual Property & Technology Management.
I see that you guys came up with some of the same information on your own.
Here are a couple of additional links:
The article in this first link documents problems with the original engine & seems to make clear that the change to Mitsubishi was for reasons of both reliability & cost:
Daimler-Mercedes designed, engineered, and manufactured these engines and named them "suprex". Garrett did provide the turbocharger, as it has done for other Mercedes engines. It is evident that were was no company named "Suprex" involved either w/ the design or manufacturer of the turbocharger or the engine.
A smart fortwo has notched up a staggering 339,600 miles:
more than 13 times around the equator.
The iconic car, first registered in 2000, is still running on the original 3-cylinder engine and gearbox. It began its life 5 years ago doing daily trips of almost 200 miles for a German dental laboratory and has since been run by an automotive magazine.
The car’s repair history during its marathon mileage has been unspectacular: the original brakes were changed at 84,000 miles and the clutch at 96,000 miles. All other repairs have been minor and the car is still going strong..
Chris Smith, Car Editor at Glass’s Guide, said:
“Facts like these underpin our opinion that the smart fortwo has the best residual value of any of its competitors.”
Jeremy Simpson, head of smart in the UK and Ireland, said:
“Many people make the assumption that small cars are not particularly durable, however, smart is no ordinary small car because it is engineered by Mercedes-Benz. It has been seven years since the original fortwo was launched in Europe and so it’s no surprise to see stories like this appearing around the world.”
The smart fortwo was launched in the UK in October 2000 and there are now more than 37,000 models on British roads. Prices for the fortwo range start from £6,810 in the UK.
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I mean, someone could say that it was designed by VW, but that doesn't make it factual!
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