Help wanted from car audio enthusiast (can provide beer)

[dovienya]

So, I've been spending far too much time lately learning about car audio systems.

I'm still not certain what I am going to want to do about a head unit. Ideally I'd like a decent in dash nav, and good pairing functionality with an iphone. However, those types of head units tend to run quite a lot of money, so maybe I might be better starting with the speaker end of things, and seeing what sort of money I end up having left for a head unit.

My hope is that a local smartie that's done their own audio system(s) may be interested in giving some guidance on all of this. If I add an under dash sub, is an external amp absolutely needed if my headunit has okay wattage? I dont need that much kick, just a more "full" sound than what I have. Then there's the question of crossovers, wiring practices, etc...

I'm a do-it-yourself kind of guy, but there's an awful lot of info to try to assimilate. Anyone in Portland want to help spend OPM (other people's money) and get beer in the process?

dovienya

[dlomshek]

How much money do you have or want to spend on this project? What's the budget?

[John_H]

dovienya - would you like to listen to what an okay pair of speakers and sound dampening on the doors does to the sounds from a cheap head unit? I'm over in Clackamas and currently "a gentleman of leisure" so I'd be able to provide a listen any ol' time.

[mkhyper1]

I've been a car audio nut for 20 years. General theory for car stereo on a budget is to invest as follows:

1. Upgrade existing speakers. On the smart this means 6.5" in the doors and tweeters in the dash up by the window. This is an easy diy project.
2. Add a subwoofer and amplifier to drive it. If you are going to stick to the factory head unit, pick an amp with speaker level inputs. You can then just run speaker wiring directly from the factory wiring to the amp. Pick an amp that has a low pass filter which is a built in crossover that cuts out the highs which you sub won't like. I put the kicker 8" dual voice coil 4 ohm sub in an under dash sealed box. The sub coils are wired in parallel presenting a 2 ohm load to the amp. As a rough rule of thumb, match the RMS power rating to the RMS power rating of the sub.
3. Consider. Adding a second amp to power your speakers. Alternatively, if you plan ahead and buy the right amp, you can do it all with one, running 3 channels.
4. Sound dampening materials like Dynamat will greatly enhance the sound level and radiant heat in the car.
5. Pick a head unit. Thi will provide an incremental boost of the sound quality but also give yo all the gadgets you are looking for.

I was unable to find any place other than the trunk to put the amps, although I have bee thiking about some fiberglass fabrication to put them in the boot storage hatch.

Best of luck. Happy to answer any questions you have.

Agin, the single best thing you can do is replace the factory speakers. Go to a store and listen till you find a set you like.

[John_H]

Originally Posted by mkhyper1

4. Sound dampening materials like Dynamat will greatly enhance the sound level and radiant heat in the car.

How does sound dampening material enhance radiated heat? And just what do you mean by "enhance?"

[dovienya]

Originally Posted by dlomshek

How much money do you have or want to spend on this project? What's the budget?

In my perfect little imaginary world, I think I'd like to get everything on my wish list for $800.

Reality tells me that aint gonna happen. Either I'm going to invest more money over time, or I'm going to need to give up on some parts of that wish list. If it comes to giving up on part of it, I think I'd most likely give up the Nav, so logically that means I should start this project with the speakers.

Originally Posted by John_H

dovienya - would you like to listen to what an okay pair of speakers and sound dampening on the doors does to the sounds from a cheap head unit? I'm over in Clackamas and currently "a gentleman of leisure" so I'd be able to provide a listen any ol' time.

John, thank you, I may just take you up on that offer. I know I'm not a true audiophile, in that I am happy listening to mp3s with a tiny (yet high quality) pair of IEMs. I've known lots of audio snobs, and they wouldnt ever stoop that low. As such, I wouldnt be surprised if the right combination of "okay" speakers and a "cheap" head unit would do me just fine. If I were to make it over towards Clackamas, it would likely be over the weekend or next week. Would you mind if I were to send you a PM about that as I find out a little more about what my schedule will be?

Originally Posted by mkhyper1

I've been a car audio nut for 20 years. General theory for car stereo on a budget is to invest as follows:

1. Upgrade existing speakers. On the smart this means 6.5" in the doors and tweeters in the dash up by the window. This is an easy diy project.
2. Add a subwoofer and amplifier to drive it. If you are going to stick to the factory head unit, pick an amp with speaker level inputs. You can then just run speaker wiring directly from the factory wiring to the amp. Pick an amp that has a low pass filter which is a built in crossover that cuts out the highs which you sub won't like. I put the kicker 8" dual voice coil 4 ohm sub in an under dash sealed box. The sub coils are wired in parallel presenting a 2 ohm load to the amp. As a rough rule of thumb, match the RMS power rating to the RMS power rating of the sub.
3. Consider. Adding a second amp to power your speakers. Alternatively, if you plan ahead and buy the right amp, you can do it all with one, running 3 channels.
4. Sound dampening materials like Dynamat will greatly enhance the sound level and radiant heat in the car.
5. Pick a head unit. Thi will provide an incremental boost of the sound quality but also give yo all the gadgets you are looking for.

I was unable to find any place other than the trunk to put the amps, although I have bee thiking about some fiberglass fabrication to put them in the boot storage hatch.

Best of luck. Happy to answer any questions you have.

Agin, the single best thing you can do is replace the factory speakers. Go to a store and listen till you find a set you like.

Thank you, this is exactly the sort of list I've been working on figuring out. The problem is, I have very little experience with this sort of stuff, so I really dont know how big of an impact each item might present.

I have already replaced the door speakers. I have the radio 9 system, so no tweeters (currently) in the dash, but I went with the popular Polk db651 coax speakers. That helped a lot, but still feels...flat. I tend to listen to a lot of electronic music, which generally can be all over the place frequency wise. I know these speakers arent giving the lows I'd like, and I'm not entirely sure about the high end, either.

Amp terminology is one of the areas I really feel out of my element in. That helps a bit. I still dont know where I'll be going in that regard, but I suspect I will end up wanting to add a sub. Say I were to get a head unit that has four 22 watt (rms) channels, which seems common of what I have looked at, would running a pair of those channels to the sub not be enough power to drive it properly? Trying to figure out what to do with amps is an issue, as I'd prefer to keep from cutting up the carpet/etc.

It sounds like I may get to hear a bit of the difference than dampening can make from John soon. That might help me figure things out a little bit.

[mkhyper1]

Sound dampening material obviously helps with road noise, vibration noise and stiffening the sound from the speakers. Dynamat, and some others, have some radiant barrier properties as well to help cut down radiant heat. Dynamat has.a reflective barrier that helps in this regard. I went overboard on my Smart and covered the entire interior with dynamat and then followed with a layer of dynaliner (1/8thinch) and the trunk/engine area with 1/2 inch Dynaliner. This product is specifically designed to cut down heat and has some sound dampening properties. The whole job took about 8 hours for my son and I to remove the seats, accelerator, panels and carpeting, apply the materials and then put it all back in. We were exhausted by the end. But, it works great.

A sub and amp would definately fix the lows. I pre-ran all my wiring when I had the carpet out. Real easy and no cutting. I would also look into some tweeters for the cartory location. They should be easy to install and its already wired. The factory head unit will drive them.

As to using a head unit'a amp to drive the sub, I wouldn't suggest this. Subs take lots of power to produce clean sound, especially in a small sealed box like the underdash models for the smart. Head units just can't provide enough power. They are fine for the door and dassh speakers though so use the speaker outs from your new head unit to drive them.

You should be able to do the sub, box and amp for a few hundred dollars if youu shop around and do the work yourself.

Good luck

[mkhyper1]

Sound dampening material obviously helps with road noise, vibration noise and stiffening the sound from the speakers. Dynamat, and some others, have some radiant barrier properties as well to help cut down radiant heat. Dynamat has.a reflective barrier that helps in this regard. I went overboard on my Smart and covered the entire interior with dynamat and then followed with a layer of dynaliner (1/8thinch) and the trunk/engine area with 1/2 inch Dynaliner. This product is specifically designed to cut down heat and has some sound dampening properties. The whole job took about 8 hours for my son and I to remove the seats, accelerator, panels and carpeting, apply the materials and then put it all back in. We were exhausted by the end. But, it works great.

A sub and amp would definately fix the lows. I pre-ran all my wiring when I had the carpet out. Real easy and no cutting. I would also look into some tweeters for the cartory location. They should be easy to install and its already wired. The factory head unit will drive them.

As to using a head unit'a amp to drive the sub, I wouldn't suggest this. Subs take lots of power to produce clean sound, especially in a small sealed box like the underdash models for the smart. Head units just can't provide enough power. They are fine for the door and dassh speakers though so use the speaker outs from your new head unit to drive them.

You should be able to do the sub, box and amp for a few hundred dollars if youu shop around and do the work yourself.

Good luck