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Old 06-24-2009, 07:15 PM   #21 (permalink)
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I saw a comparison between hydrogen and gas powered vehicles. With hydrogen, the gas goes up and burns. With gas, it splashes on every thing and burns.

I read that they had developed a safe way to store the hydrogen and it would not leak or explode even if it was dented. It was a documentary on electric vehicles.

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Old 06-24-2009, 08:04 PM   #22 (permalink)
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here's another water powered car...OK...steam...

"British steampunks have successfully tested a steam-powered car they want to see race across the California desert at 170 mph. They aim to break a record that has stood for more than a century".

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Old 06-24-2009, 11:21 PM   #23 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by kurt013 View Post
There is no free lunch. It takes energy to separate the hydrogen from oxygen in water. Look at the label on a bottle of water, it has no calories. No calories means no energy. I would guess that either this is a complete scam, or that the "energy generator" needs to be recharged frequently and expensively.
Curt how many calories in a gallon of gas?
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Old 06-25-2009, 06:00 AM   #24 (permalink)
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...good one Karl..good one..
..since you put it so delicately... let me tip toe through the land mines and ask..
...regular or premium?...leaded or unleaded?..

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Old 06-25-2009, 06:36 PM   #25 (permalink)
 
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Actually, Bob, the energy to break a bond is the same as when you combine them under the right circumstances. But the major point is you cannot extract *more* energy. It's the reciprocity (splitting/combining are same energy) that help make hydrogen a superb energy storage device for fuel cells! (But not so much for internal combustion).

Like with all systems, there is some practical loss - friction, resistance, heat, light - that makes it so it's not a perpetual motion machine. Similar principles are behind why you can't use a generator to provide enough electricity to run a motor to power the generator and - viola! - free electricity. No.
I should have clarified and used the term, "Usable Energy".

So yes, E(in) = E(out), but as you pointed out, there's there are several losses that we can't recover the energy from...


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Old 06-25-2009, 07:21 PM   #26 (permalink)
 
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But most of the energy can be recovered from electrolysis generation of hydrogen and fuel cell consumption to turn hydrogen and oxygen directly to electricity without combustion.
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Old 06-25-2009, 07:58 PM   #27 (permalink)
 
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As pointed out above, there is the equivalent of about 17,500 calories in a pint of gasoline. Calories are measured by the amount of heat (energy) given off when the subject is burned.
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Old 06-25-2009, 08:08 PM   #28 (permalink)
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As pointed out above, there is the equivalent of about 17,500 calories in a pint of gasoline. Calories are measured by the amount of heat (energy) given off when the subject is burned.
For the love of god stop eating gasoline.
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Old 06-25-2009, 08:30 PM   #29 (permalink)
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the potential heat you can generate by burning gasoline depends on too many variables; the octane, for one...as well as the fuel/oxygen mixture, etc.
... a calorie is the amount of energy, or heat, it takes to raise the temperature of 1 gram of water 1 degree Celsius (1.8 degrees Fahrenheit)...
...A gallon of gasoline contains 31,000 kilocalories or 31,000,000 calories...but who's counting..

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