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post #1 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-20-2019, 07:58 AM Thread Starter
 
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Question EV battery replacement.

Hello,


I have a 2014 Smart For Two electric with 20,000 km which I purchased a year ago for $10,000.

The local MINI service center here in Toronto advised me yesterday the EV battery needs to be replaced. The MINI center will be able to install it for around $1,200. The cost of the OEM EV battery from them is $11,000.

I found a few used EV batteries availabe at the junk yards here in Canada and more in USA for around $1,000. The problem is the MINI refuse to deal with aftermarket part and there is no trained independent mechanic locally who would do the job. I found one British mechanic who claimed to be an expert in Smarts, but after researching the issue he refused as well.



Please advise where to find someone who would do the job! Need one ASAP!
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post #2 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-20-2019, 09:35 AM
 
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Were these used batteries tested? It would be difficult to test them once removed from a working car. Certainly a junkyard would not have the equipment or training to do it. Even just manually checking the pack voltage (much less the individual cell voltages) would involve opening the battery case (with lots of safety precautions) - and the BMS could still be bad.
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post #3 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-20-2019, 10:21 AM
 
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At this point I would part the 2014 and go lease a new one with a full battery warranty. I got a new 2018 EV that was loaded (every option). No 'drive-off' fees, sign and drive and the payment is $169/month...


Oh, I speak from experience. My 2015 EV gave up the battery with 6 months left on the lease. MB Financial made the last 6 payments and sent me on my way in a far superior product.
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post #4 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-20-2019, 08:50 PM
 
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Wait, how long is the battery warranty there in Canada? Shouldn’t it still be under warranty?
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post #5 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 03:01 PM
 
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Unlike other EV's which have 8 or more year battery warranties, the smart battery warranty is the same as the rest of the drivetrain warranty - only 4 years or 50k miles (80k km in Canada?).

However, recall in past fora about the old BAP plan, we discussed whether MB is actually legally obligated under emissions control regulations to honor an 8 (or 10?) year warranty for the battery in at least all US CARB states. We even were looking under the rear mat to see if a California-compliance placard was present - and all of the Smarts seemed to have them.

I'm not sure about Canada, although their regulations are usually harmonized with the US.

Discussion is here:


https://www.smartcarofamerica.com/fo...ld-you-148737/

Last edited by Yinzer; 04-22-2019 at 09:38 AM.
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post #6 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-22-2019, 04:45 AM
 
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I have to ask. Is the vehicle not charging or driveable? Why are they recommending replacement? Is there a safety concern?
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post #7 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-22-2019, 09:46 AM
 
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The battery is in a internal fault shutdown. It is a safety feature since over-discharged cells can explosively catch fire if recharged. Of course, the shutdown could be erroneous, but nonetheless, MB requires all service personnel to treat the battery pack as a sealed "black box". No internal battery components (cells, relays, the BMS pc board) are available for replacement. So, the only recourse is replacing the whole battery.
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post #8 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-23-2019, 10:57 AM
 
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The Smart Center I have gone to had to replace my battery due to an error on their part. They were doing some warranty work and messed up the connection to the battery. That was in 2016. They told me the battery would have been $29,000 back then. So $11,000 at least sounds a little better.

My guess is that the cost includes surface shipping it from Germany or France or wherever it comes from. They told me at the time that they don’t even stock the batteries here they n North America. So this is going to be an eventual issue for a lot of EDs owners in the US and Canada. It would be really difficult to spend more on the battery than the car is worth for me.


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post #9 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-23-2019, 06:21 PM
 
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Originally Posted by emailchrishall View Post
The Smart Center I have gone to had to replace my battery due to an error on their part. They were doing some warranty work and messed up the connection to the battery.
The number of ways that the Smart battery can be rendered unusable - even though there is not actually anything physically wrong with it - just vaporous software declaring it toast, or at worst, a bad pc board, is utter farce. Surely, LEAFs, Teslas Bolts, Volts, Kona's etc. don't do this?
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post #10 of 33 (permalink) Old 04-23-2019, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Yinzer View Post
Surely, LEAFs, Teslas Bolts, Volts, Kona's etc. don't do this?
Here's a Tesla BRICK story. A quick search will show others to include Leaf...

"Here’s a fun fact: Batteries and cars require maintenance. The Tesla Roadster runs on batteries that require lots of maintenance. Out of the 2,200 Roadster owners, apparently at least five didn’t read the manual on their new toy and let the car sit off the charger for several months – or so says one regional service manager. This is a no-no according to Tesla. The result? The $40,000 battery packs completely died and needed to be replaced at the owner’s expense."

https://techcrunch.com/2012/02/22/th...-its-nonsense/

But Elon says . . .

"Should the battery die, Tesla will replace it at no cost with a battery of equal or better energy capacity. Tesla's battery warranty currently lasts eight years. In developing the Model S, we took great care to ensure that the battery would protect itself, always retaining a few percent of energy. If something goes wrong, it is therefore our fault, not yours," reads the release."

https://www.theverge.com/2013/4/26/4...-unconditional

"The Leaf owners’ manual addresses this by explaining:
The Li-ion battery discharges gradually if the vehicle is parked for a long time. Nissan recommends charging the Li-ion battery every 3 months using the long life mode charging method to keep the Li-ion battery in good condition. Do not leave the Li-ion battery fully discharged or with a very low charge level for a long period of time.”

Nissan also specifies conditions under which it won’t honor its standard eight-year warranty for the Leaf’s battery. According to the manual, there are four things you must not do to the Leaf’s lithium-ion battery if you want to preserve your warranty:
Don’t expose it to temperatures over 120-degrees Fahrenheit for more than 24 hours.

Don’t leave it for more than 14 days with the battery fully, or near-fully discharged.

Don’t store it in temperatures below -13 degrees Fahrenheit for more than seven days.

And don’t top it off daily, if it already has a charge of more than 98 percent."

https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/...tery/index.htm
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