2009 smart fortwo won't start - Page 2 - Smart Car Forums
User Tag List

 1Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old 07-15-2019, 09:00 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 8
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
When the ignition switch is activated the switch sends out data signals to all computers ( the instrument cluster is a computer as well ) on a few different data lines leading off of the switch which then tells the computers to power on.
In some cases, one or more of the data lines can fail in the switch or they may all fail.

If someone had a key that is just the blade and put it in the ignition and turned the ignition on to see if the instrumrnt cluster would light up or not.

Last edited by perked; 07-15-2019 at 01:36 PM.
perked is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old 07-15-2019, 07:51 PM
 
dhlairbusb4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 106
Thanks: 11
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
This probably will not help, but I got two keys with my car. I was told one was bad, and needed reprograming. I looked into that, and was about to send it off. But some where I read to try this.
Kind of similar to re learning the clutch actuator... I used the fob to lock, then unlock doors, foot on brake, inserted key to pos 1, then did the shifter thru all gears, then back to P, foot off brake, and key off.
Oddly enough, my key that would only open the doors before, became fully functional, it starts the car just fine.
Now, I do not remember if the instrument cluster illuminated or not prior to the key starting to work.
Also, have you tried to disconnect the battery for a while? Maybe leave it disconnected over night?
Just shooting from the hip, but you never can tell, and if it saves you from taking it to a dealer.....GR8!
Where are you located, someone out there has got to be able to lend a hand.
dhlairbusb4 is offline  
post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old 07-16-2019, 01:05 AM
King of Smart Gadgetry
SCOA Club
 
DreamCarOwner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Parkersburg, W.Va
Posts: 1,044
Thanks: 257
Thanked 229 Times in 162 Posts
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 315 Post(s)
Garage
I am pretty sure that the switch itself is a typical on-off switch that opens or closes a contact to the SAM to tell the SAM to turn on. Once it turns on, the immobilizer ring around the switch reads your chip in your key and if the codes match the Sam goes ahead and cranks the engine over. The split second it starts to turn over you can release the key and the SAM will continue to roll the starter until the engine starts. When you first insert your key into the switch and turn it right over to start, you will notice that there is a short delay before the engine cranks. That is because the CANBUS is initializing. The Sam does most of the work but when it comes to CANBUS and the storing of error codes, that all happens in the instrument cluster. It stores info on the state of the CANBUS. But the cluster receives it's power from the SAM. The SAM is the central power to fire up all the modules and the instrument cluster. I think I would drop down the SAM or unplug the connectors and completely remove it. Open it up and look for corrosion or cold solder joints. The SAM boards are multi-layer so they are interconnected with ribbon cables, so there is a lot to check. There is a large red cable on the top side of the SAM that powers it from the battery. Check that connection and also read the voltage there to see of the SAM is actually receiving power. There are several relays inside the SAM that controls various things but I would just almost bet your power problem is inside the SAM. I have a PDF of the procedure for removing the SAM if you need it. Just PM me your emai address if you need it. I have more info I could probably conjure up. I have a lot of stuff archived on my laptop. Lastly do you have 4 way flashers that will turn on and flash? They will operate with the key off. So that should tell you if you are getting something from the battery. If you have the factory lowline radio (non CD and mp3 jack in the glove box) try the radio. It will operate 15 minutes before shutting itself down when the key is not on. So does that work also? You can remove the instrument cluster by grabbing both sides of it and gently pulling it towards you. Check those connections. If you have the Tach and clock pods those 3 wires run to the instrument cluster too. But check the connections. I have the pinout diagrams I think in a Microsoft Word format if you would need that. Last of all to check for power I would raise the car up in the rear and crawl under the driver side and remove that little cover that covers up the starter's solenoid and check for voltage there. If there is voltage bridge the battery terminal wire on the starter to the smaller wire and see if that activates the starter. DCO
Smart Bob likes this.
DreamCarOwner is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old 07-16-2019, 06:47 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 8
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yes it is my understanding that the ignition switch turns the SAM unit on and off and the SAM unit feeds power to the other components.
I have had the SAM unit loose from the car to check the fuses on the back side but did not completely remove it. I see there is a good article over on evolution about the sam unit. I will remove the SAM unit and check all the plugs for corrosion and burnt pins. I have checked and there is 12 volts at the starter, I jumped the starter terminals and it did activate the starter.
I know the SAM is getting power because some things work like the wipers, blower motor, headlights, tun signals. I will check the instrument cluster fuse which I believe is fuse 12 to see if there is 12 volt there.
perked is offline  
post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old 07-17-2019, 05:57 AM
 
Snowball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Northview, MI
Posts: 22
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
I saw a You Tube video of a young fella that had a similar electrical issue and he fixed it by touching up the solder joints on the SAM unit.

His channel is Aging Wheels. I'm not allowed to post links yet.

Search for video, "I fixed my Smart for Free".
Snowball is offline  
post #16 of 19 (permalink) Old 07-18-2019, 07:21 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 8
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I removed the SAM from the car and did not see any burnt or corroded pins or plugs. I took the SAM apart and could not find any cold solder joins or corrosion anywhere. I did see where here had been water in the SAM at one time so maybe it shorted something out.
I have been told by MB I can not take a SAM unit from a different smart car and put in mine, it won't work. Has anyone tried this?
perked is offline  
post #17 of 19 (permalink) Old 07-18-2019, 08:27 AM
Bohemian Moderator 451gas
SCOA Club
 
jwight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Dayton, OH USA
Posts: 28,128
Thanks: 7,373
Thanked 5,811 Times in 3,523 Posts
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 78 Post(s)
Garage
It will not work unless the SAM is recoded to your VIN. A company called SOS Diagnostics might be able to help you.

Last edited by jwight; 07-18-2019 at 08:51 AM.
jwight is offline  
post #18 of 19 (permalink) Old 07-18-2019, 02:09 PM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 8
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thanks for the info jwight, I will give them a shout.
perked is offline  
post #19 of 19 (permalink) Old 07-19-2019, 10:58 AM
King of Smart Gadgetry
SCOA Club
 
DreamCarOwner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Parkersburg, W.Va
Posts: 1,044
Thanks: 257
Thanked 229 Times in 162 Posts
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 315 Post(s)
Garage
I am not sure but as far as I am aware the only parts of the CANBUS system that records the VIN inside is the SAM, the instrument cluster and the Air Bag module. I don't know if this is correct as I haven't found the info to support or disagree one way or the other. I have replaced my air bag module on mine because I damaged the originally as I was attempting to fix a faulty seat belt error that I could not get resolved. I transplanted another air bag module from another Fortwo but I get the VIN number does not match error and still have the original seat belt error code. So it seems MB has thought out the whole scenario of replacing individual modules yourself with having access to a STAR computer to sew it all back together. DCO
DreamCarOwner is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Smart Car Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome
 

Clubs, Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.