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How can I tell if the mechanic installed a new starter

650 Views 20 Replies 10 Participants Last post by  m3659990
My 2011 Smart fortwo couldn't start at a supermarket parking lot last Wed. I had it towed to an ARCO mechanic near by and the next day, I was charged $1421 to get a new starter installed. The reason I sent the car there was that the shop is a neighborhood shop and many in the area think it trustworthy. I only had smog check done there, though.

The shop charged me $800+ for the part and $500 for problem determination and labor foe installation. The rest is taxes.

I have a gut feeling that I was seriously ripped off; but at least my car is running again. I didn't think of asking to see the dead starter nor to see the box for the new starter. How can I tell if the part is genuine and not an aftermarket/refurbished item? It gives me a lot of distress to NOT know and that I might have paid all that money for something that would soon break down again.

Does anyone have a guess what the dealer might have charged?

Any thoughts, anyone? Thank you for your time.
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A quick Google for a 2011 smart fortwo starter shows around $200 for the part. $300 if purchased through Mercedes.

You got screwed.

Just my $.02.
Jim
Hi Jim. Yes, I am afraid that was the case. (I think you meant for the 2011 model, not the 2001 model.) Now I am mostly concerned whether they even put in a brand new one. That's why I had always serviced my car at the dealership. 😰
If you have already paid, I am sorry but it may be too late do much. If that’s the case its lessons learned time. Below are a few things that may help in the future.

Before the repair

When taking a car in for a repair always ask for an estimate. They may not want to give it because they know something can and often does go askew during the repair, such as rusted or stripped bolts and other unforeseen problems. Make it clear that you want a “ball park” figure.

This does 2 things;
  • It forces them to take the time to look at the problem/repair as opposed to throwing out a high number to cover themselves. A good estimate takes time and it’s mostly uncompensated. A good mechanic sees this as just part of it. The practice of overestimation in my opinion is based on laziness.
  • It will somewhat inoculate you to sticker shock.
The estimate should be based on a scheduled hourly rate and a time estimate. Mechanics have access to “book” time rates which spell out specific amounts of time for a particular repair on a particular make and model.

Prior to leaving the car with a shop, ask that they return the old parts to you. Take a cell phone photo of the area or part to be replaced. This necessitates that you become familiar with your car and its general layout. For instance you will need to be able to identify the basic components that are to be replaced. If you can’t tell the starter from the alternator it can be blood in the water for a predatory “mechanic”. It’s easy to educate yourself with google etc. The object is to empower yourself with knowledge, not to go toe to toe with mechanic. You don’t need to know how an alternator works; you do need to know what it looks like, where it is on the car and generally what it does.

Some, dare I say many, mechanics are unfamiliar with Smarties. The idea that many Smart for Two repairs involve removing numerous body panels and lowering the engine for access to replace components is foreign to them. Similar operations on most other cars would be very expensive. The time it takes to do this on a smart is designed to be minimal. I can say that removing both rear fenders, the tailgate and the bumper requires only a few minutes. I have never lowered the engine on my car, but I suspect that’s also requires minimal time.

After the repair

If you are unsure if the repair was actually done, you can often check their work.

Learn to “read the dirt”. Compare the pictures you made to the same area/part afterwards to see if it’s different or obviously new. Compare the old parts they gave you to see if they were actually removed from your car. Speaking from experience, most rip-off artists are too lazy to cover their tracks. To do a repair it’s necessary to do some cleaning in the areas adjacent to the repair. The repair will disturb the dirt and grease around the repair and it’s often obvious if anyone has been in there. If it looks the same as before, they found a quick way to get the car back on the road and charged you for work they didn’t do.

Always pay with a credit card so you can contest the bill if you feel you have been unfairly charged.

If you have AAA you can also register a complaint. Good luck.
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Back to the original question...

Starting with post #10 there are photos of the old starter; the new starter should look nice and shiney. :)
PS - you may be able to get the BBB to look into this obvious price gouging, or use the small claims court route.
Thanks everyone for the feedback. I really appreciate it. Now I can only hope that whatever starter is used, it will last for a while. Another sad thing is, according to the Bluebook estimate, the car is worth only around $2800.
The car might be worth only $2,800. Try buying another car, for that low price. It really worth
your while, to just replace the starter. If you enjoy driving your car.
That is true, smark! I do like my car, especially being a Swatch fan. :)
Market price is higher than KBB because the economy is acting odd when it comes to used cars. New cars are hard to get and a lot more expensive. People are paying outlandish prices for used good ones. This is even going to exacerbate as fewer ICE cars are built and production focused on electric. Until charging stations are more plentiful nationwide, the ranges are extended and the price comes down, people are going to want used cars.
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(I think you meant for the 2011 model, not the 2001 model.)
Yes, a typo (since corrected) thank you.

Jim
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This is a picture of my 2011 Smart engine and a zoomed in picture of the starter (I think).

Is the starter inside the silver housing? When a starter is replaced, does the silver housing get replaced as well?

It doesn't look like there was much disturbance near the silver housing, maybe it was just the fuse that got replaced, not the starter?

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The shiney object with the brass colored stripe is your alternator. The object in the other photo is part of the emissions system. The starter is down below and not visible from the top side. If I am incorrect, I am sure someone will let you know.
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The starter is on the bottom of the motor. Here is a link that shows it
Thanks 1983JZR3W and mblackwell for teaching me about my car. I will have to wait for tye next opportunity to check. I think I will let this rest and consider it an expensive lesson learned.
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Good on ya! Those lessons are are the hardest to accept, but if you can accept them they can be the best learning experiences. I am reminded of my own lessons by a damaged fastener from a DIY Volvo repair gone wrong. It's taped to the front of my tool box so that I see it all the time. I am too embarrassed to tell anyone about the specifics, but it taught me a lot. Hang in there, it gets better.
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Not sure how close you are to Signal Hill but check out Smart Madness for everything from routine service to modifications:

2716 Dawson Ave.
Signal Hill, CA 90755
562-981-6800
Mon-Fri: 9 AM - 6PM PST
Sat-Sun: Closed
:)
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hi jwight, I am in San Diego, Signal Hill is south of Los Angeles, about 100 miles away. I came across Smart Madness when I was looking for a bike rack. I am infact thinking of visiting it later this week. They seen reliable. Thanks.
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If you want to learn more about your car (and cars in general), ChrisFix has a wonderful YouTube channel where he covers almost anything you can do to your car, at home, with basic hand tools.

He even has a video about starters.
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My 2011 Smart fortwo couldn't start at a supermarket parking lot last Wed. I had it towed to an ARCO mechanic near by and the next day, I was charged $1421 to get a new starter installed. The reason I sent the car there was that the shop is a neighborhood shop and many in the area think it trustworthy. I only had smog check done there, though. The shop charged me $800+ for the part and $500 for problem determination and labor foe installation. The rest is taxes. I have a gut feeling that I was seriously ripped off; but at least my car is running again. I didn't think of asking to see the dead starter nor to see the box for the new starter. How can I tell if the part is genuine and not an aftermarket/refurbished item? It gives me a lot of distress to NOT know and that I might have paid all that money for something that would soon break down again. Does anyone have a guess what the dealer might have charged? Any thoughts, anyone? Thank you for your time.
First of all I’m a smart car specialist in Des Moines Iowa who works on smart cars daily and I own 10 of them myself. I’ve never seen a starter fail unless they are exposed to salty winter roads. The early ones starting around 2010 smart started putting protective covers on the starters to keep them out of the elements. It takes about 15 minutes to replace a starter. For smart car repair call Larry at Ace Body and Motor. 515-243-7133 www.acebodyandmotor.com
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