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A few months ago I had a conversation with a salesperson at a local used car dealership specializing in used all-electric cars. He said he no longer sells used smart ED's because of uncertainty around the terms of the Battery Assurance Plus (BAP) program. Most of the smart ED's he sold came from lease returns. Apparently, the lease comes with BAP automatically so every lease-return has BAP. He sold a few to customers that were later contacted by debt collection agencies trying to collect for missed BAP payments. The buyer's didn't know they were supposed to be making BAP payments.

This salesperson expressed the belief that MB-USA will be terminating the BAP program entirely as the legal liability has become too large for such a small number of cars on the road.

Does anybody on the forum have any more information on this? FWIW, I bought my car outright, but I am leasing my battery under the BAP program so my interest isn't academic.
 

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A few months ago I had a conversation with a salesperson at a local used car dealership specializing in used all-electric cars.

This salesperson expressed the belief that MB-USA will be terminating the BAP program entirely as the legal liability has become too large for such a small number of cars on the road.
With all due respect to car salespersons everywhere - they are NOT considered a reliable source of NEWS!

As for his belief - I believe I will have another beer. :cheers:

Even though "in the scheme of things" the BAP population is small, the "exit strategy" could be complicated especially on a vehicle sold originally with NO profit margin.

Likely your friends and family at SCoA will have this news flash (should it occur?) long before an off M-B used EV dealer will?
 

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I don't see how the car buyer could be legally responsible for anything he didn't sign. The BAP contract was with the original buyer of the car. For lease returns, this presumably was resolved at the end of the lease. So unless the used car-dealer or used-car buyer signs a new contract, how can anyone be collected upon?

You would think MB would do one of three things when they send lease returns to auctions:
1) sell them as entire cars including batteries
2) remove the batteries and sell the sleds
3) sell the sleds with batteries installed and include a new BAP contract

Unless it's 3, in which case the used-car dealer should know what they signed, there is nothing to collect.

Of course if it's not a lease-return but a purchased car with BAP battery that someone decided to trade in for something else, then the original owner would continue to be responsible for the payments, unless he returned the battery to MB before selling the car. AFAIK that's the only way to get out of the contract.
 

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Know of only one instance several years ago wherein a salvage ED had the DAMAGED BAP battery pack removed by M-B - the sled only was then sold as salvage with the VIN# being blacklisted by M-B such that they would not sell or rent a replacement pack. That ED ended up being parted out . . .

Today you could likely buy a salvage sled, find a pack somewhere and have a complete ED?
 

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Know of only one instance several years ago wherein a salvage ED had the DAMAGED BAP battery pack removed by M-B - the sled only was then sold as salvage with the VIN# being blacklisted by M-B such that they would not sell or rent a replacement pack. That ED ended up being parted out . . .

Today you could likely buy a salvage sled, find a pack somewhere and have a complete ED?
I could only find an inverter/converter on Car-Part.com--Used Auto Parts Market for someone with an issue buying a used ED on another thread with "suprise" BAP. Could possibly call that yard to see if they have the battery....
 

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It's an interesting exercise, one I didn't want to play out. My used car dealer sold it with an outright promise, even wrote it down, no battery lease, when he sold me the off lease car. A month later I called MB and learned the truth. When I contacted the dealer, they said they didn't make enough to handle the lease on their end, and agreed they told me it was not necessary. They were nervous and eager to return the car and make total refund though. I imagine it would be a costly legal exercise even if you won that battle.
 

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It's an interesting exercise, one I didn't want to play out. My used car dealer sold it with an outright promise, even wrote it down, no battery lease, when he sold me the off lease car. A month later I called MB and learned the truth. When I contacted the dealer, they said they didn't make enough to handle the lease on their end, and agreed they told me it was not necessary. They were nervous and eager to return the car and make total refund though. I imagine it would be a costly legal exercise even if you won that battle.
All legal recourse would be with the one who signed the first/original lease agreement. It would be a hard battle for even Mercedes to try to go after someone who unknowingly bought a sled, without it being disclosed to them upon the 2nd hand sale.... I would assume that these second hand owners are not having any issues because Mercedes is busy "collecting" from the original lessee.

I'm going on disclosure requirements. For goodness sake, there's one for snow chains....
 

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WHen an electric smart is leased, 99% ( I suspect) came with BAP. If they did not, the lease would have been much, much more expensive.

After the lease is returned, MB auctions off the cars to either MB/smart dealers or small used car dealers. At the auctions, Mercedes makes it clear that BAP must be continued/purchased with the vehicle. (MB offers to pay for 2 months of BAP if an MB/smart dealer buys the EV smart from the auction.) The dealer is responsible for paying BAP while it is on their lot beyond that, and then when it is sold the final customer assumes the BAP payments. Dealers should make that clear to their customers. Its possible that the used car dealers don't know what they are agreeing to when they buy a smart ED car at auction and told that it includes BAP. Thats on them to know what they are agreeing to when they sign for the vehicle.

The customer is supposed to register the car with MB/smart (call MBenz Financial Services) to pay the BAP payments and keep the warranty active. If they miss BAP payments, I believe it could do to debt collector. If they don't pay for the warranty, then I don't image the car/battery would be covered by warranty if anything went wrong.

If a customer/dealer doesn't want to pay BAP for the remaining 7 years after a lease, they would pay back the original $5,010 discount that was given when the lease customer chose BAP.
 

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"... because Mercedes is busy "collecting" from the original lessee."

Good luck with that...

The "original lessee" turned it back to MBFS who owned BOTH the sled and the battery before reselling the COMPLETE ED at auction?

Note to other ED lessees, make certain that you have your BAP auto pay end with the lease end.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
FWIW, the BAP contract is full of oddities and inconsistencies. Example: It clearly states that I have to return the battery at the end of the lease. However, I have it in writing from MB Financial that this isn't the case. They say I own the battery at the end of the 10 year lease.

Based on this, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that there has been a great deal of confusion about the precise terms of the BAP contract that lead to honest dealers selling people lease-return smart cars that they had no idea had BAP on them.

IMHO BAP is a real hairball.
 

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FWIW, the BAP contract is full of oddities and inconsistencies. Example: It clearly states that I have to return the battery at the end of the lease. However, I have it in writing from MB Financial that this isn't the case. They say I own the battery at the end of the 10 year lease.

Based on this, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that there has been a great deal of confusion about the precise terms of the BAP contract that lead to honest dealers selling people lease-return smart cars that they had no idea had BAP on them.

IMHO BAP is a real hairball.


This is nice to know.

I did read how you're supposed to bring the car with the battery to a location of their choosing, where they would have the battery removed, after which you need to take your car!

Seems like they got smart. What could they possibly want to do with a potentially 10 year old battery. Might be more costly to pay a technician to remove the battery than what it would be worth at that point.


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