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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
While we are extremely pleased with the overall performance of our Da Vinci, SmartCar we do have issues with the independent dealer who sold it to us: The draining dying battery issue; the lack of a second key, and TSR Enterprises not processing the paperwork for registration and plates.

We have filed complaints with Consumer Affairs, the Better Business Bureau, the AZ Attorney General, and anyone else who will listen to my rant. The official complaint is as follows:

1) We purchased a 2005 Da Vinci SmartCar form TSR Enterprises on May 31, 2007. Were provided a \"Plate Affidavit\" (Dealer Plate) with a Temporary Plate No. 090606S this Smart Car(VIN No. WME4503321J244186). This Temporary Plate expired July 15th, 2007.

While the Temporary Plate expired we still have not received the new registration, license plate or tabs. We no longer can legally drive our SmartCar.

A query to ADOT/DMV result in TSR being contacted and quired as to the status of the paperwork. As of July 27th, 2007 they had not started processing the paperwork. We will be without this car for close to three weeks.

2) When we purchased this vehicle it came with only one key. There are no key locks on the car as the doors are opened remotely/electronically by the key-remote. Should this key be lost, we will not be able to unlock the door, what-more even start the car. We requested a spare key on June 05, 2007 and as of July 27th, 2007 we have received no spare key.

3) We requested a five year extended warranty that we were willing to pay for rolled up in the price of the car. When we began to have trouble with the Dealer, we read the real, real fine print and found that it stated that unless there was an attached warranty that a 15-day implied USed Car warranty was in effect.


Just wanted Arizonies to be aware what awaits them should they attempt to do business with TSR Enterprises. Let the buyer beware!
 

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Holy Crap

AJ

WOW you've caught my eye (closed a deal on a G&K conversion TODAY).

I saw the car, I know it was registered in NH 2 days ago, I also got a thumbs up from http://www.asmartcar.com/index.html about this dealer.

DUDE good LUCK, contact G&K Conversions, they may be able to help with this night mare.

AFM
 

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Not sure that even G&K can help you. The key will be a problem. I've emailed alejake about some alternatives on the spare key, but none of them are very easy to do. A Mexican Mercedes dealer may be the closest answer in your case, if G&K cannot assist... closer than Canada, anyway. Most all problems with the smart can be solved easily, but the spare key for those owners with only one key, is a problem that has been persistent. I'll call G&K and ask if they have a way to obtain spare keys yet. I don't think they do, but I'll check and post the answer later today. I would suggest that all owners, with only one key, get another key CUT so that they have a way to get into the car. It won't help you start the car if you don't have the electronics, but it will allow you to get INTO the car if you lose your key when the car is locked. You can open the rear hatch with the key and crawl to the front to open either door from the inside. At least you wouldn't have to break into your car to retrieve anything if you had that spare physical key. Just a thought.

Ron Gaus, aSmartCar.com
 

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G&K Closed Today

For the first time in many months, G&K was closed today. Regarding their input on the key duplication issue, I've left messages with three of them for a Monday response. I'll post when I receive any answers.

Ron Gaus, aSmartCar.com
 

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Discussion Starter #5
To be fair, I have to admit that when I made my original post in this thread that I was plenty PO'd, and normally I will not commit, write, take action or post until I am less angry and more rationale.

Maybe it was a good thing though because I lit a fire under TSR Enterprises, especially after the AZ-DMV got a hold of him. Anyway, he faxed me a copy extending our temporary dealer plates up to September 11th, and he "says" that he will get our permanent license plate to us by Monday.

He also says that a Five-Year Warranty was a part of the purchase price, and that we was going to e-mail a copy to us (he told us this Friday, Friday July 27th), but we have yet to see anything yet.

I say . . . he "says" because he has never followed through with anything he has promised before. So I am in a wait-and-see mode. Now if he really can deliver on the license plate and registration, provide the warranty and get me that spare key . . . . I will gladly apologize and endorse his dealership, I may even drop some of my complaints.
 

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Regarding the spare key, I spoke to Edward at G&K this morning. He said there are several solutions right now. Some of the ZAP dealers do have the capacity to make an extra key if you have one key. In fact, the real nightmare occurs if you lose both keys. If you have, one, make some plans on getting that other one while you can. Okay, first try Tim Day at the ZAP dealer in Arizona. That may be the one that you are working through. Tim is on vacation right now and that may be why you haven't received a straight response... but he calls in regularly, so leave a specific request for him. Tim Day HAS successfully made duplicate keys in the past. That is your first choice. If that doesn't go well, contact Edward at G&K: 714-545-9503. Talk to him about your options. The cheapest is to drive your car to Santa Ana, but there are other options that get more complicated and expensive. These may be two better options than the trip to Canada or Mexico to a Mercedes dealer. Duplicate smart keys under normal circumstances around the world are upwards of $200 each. Hope this information is helpful.

Ron Gaus, aSmartCar.com
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Regarding the spare key, I spoke to Edward at G&K this morning. He said there are several solutions right now. Some of the ZAP dealers do have the capacity to make an extra key if you have one key. In fact, the real nightmare occurs if you lose both keys. If you have, one, make some plans on getting that other one while you can. Okay, first try Tim Day at the ZAP dealer in Arizona. That may be the one that you are working through. Tim is on vacation right now and that may be why you haven't received a straight response... but he calls in regularly, so leave a specific request for him. Tim Day HAS successfully made duplicate keys in the past. That is your first choice. If that doesn't go well, contact Edward at G&K: 714-545-9503. Talk to him about your options. The cheapest is to drive your car to Santa Ana, but there are other options that get more complicated and expensive. These may be two better options than the trip to Canada or Mexico to a Mercedes dealer. Duplicate smart keys under normal circumstances around the world are upwards of $200 each. Hope this information is helpful.

Ron Gaus, aSmartCar.com
I Googled the heck out of "Arizona ZAP Dealer" "Arizona-ZAP-Dealer" "Time-Day Arizona-ZAP-Dealer" and twenty other different methods for trying to find a phone number and/or e-mail address for Tim Day without any success.

Can anyone out there provide me with Mr. Day's phone number and/or e-mail address?
 

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I can help you out with that information. Tim Day Office 480-212-0002 Cell 602-318-4211 or Toll Free 1-800-B-Zapped 3010 E Main St Mesa, AZ 85213.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I can help you out with that information. Tim Day Office 480-212-0002 Cell 602-318-4211 or Toll Free 1-800-B-Zapped 3010 E Main St Mesa, AZ 85213.
Thanks for the effort and the reply. Unfortunately Tim Day works for the same TSR Enterprises that Mr. Haskins works for.

Kind of strange . . . All of The Paperwork references "TSR Enterprises - Smart Car-Zenn Electric Cars". Todd's business cards say "Smart Car Auto Sales" with no reference to "TSR Enterprises - Smart Car-Zenn Electric Cars" or "ZAP SmartCar".

Really difficult to connect a paper-trail . . . Makes me wonder why.
 

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Hey, alejake, Tim Day is the owner. He is the go-to guy for TSR. If anyone can help you there, it will be him. If he can't, go to Edward at G&K.

Ron Gaus, aSmartCar.com
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Update On TSR Complaint

TSR Enterprises - SmartCar-Zenn Electric Cars Warning

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While we are extremely pleased with the overall performance of our Da Vinci, SmartCar we do have issues with the independent dealer who sold it to us: The draining dying battery issue; the lack of a second key, and TSR Enterprises not processing the paperwork for registration and plates.

We have filed complaints with Consumer Affairs, the Better Business Bureau, the AZ Attorney General, and anyone else who will listen to my rant. The official complaint is as follows:

1) We purchased a 2005 Da Vinci SmartCar form TSR Enterprises on May 31, 2007. Were provided a \"Plate Affidavit\" (Dealer Plate) with a Temporary Plate No. 090606S this Smart Car(VIN No. WME4503321J244186). This Temporary Plate expired July 15th, 2007. While the Temporary Plate expired we still have not received the new registration, license plate or tabs. We no longer can legally drive our SmartCar.

A query to ADOT/DMV result in TSR being contacted and quired as to the status of the paperwork. As of July 27th, 2007 they had not started processing the paperwork. We will be without this car for close to three weeks. (Update: We received a faxed extension on our temporary dealer plate and was promised that the permanent license plate would be here by Monday, July 30th - No permanent AZ plate received as of this Tuesday morning July 31st)


2) When we purchased this vehicle it came with only one key. There are no key locks on the car as the doors are opened remotely/electronically by the key-remote. Should this key be lost, we will not be able to unlock the door, what-more even start the car. We requested a spare key on June 05, 2007 and as of July 27th, 2007 we have received no spare key. (Update: No change ins status - no communication)

3) We requested a five year extended warranty that we were willing to pay for rolled up in the price of the car. When we began to have trouble with the Dealer, we read the real, real fine print and found that it stated that unless there was an attached warranty that a 15-day implied Used Car warranty was in effect. (Update: Todd told us telecom that we did have a 5-year warranty and that he would e-mail or fax a copy to us on Saturday, July 28th - Still have not received the warranty as of this morning Tuesday, July 31st, 2007)


Just wanted Arizonies to be aware what awaits them should they attempt to do business with TSR Enterprises. Let the buyer beware!
 

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Gray Dealership - Buyer Beware

Thanks for the effort and the reply. Unfortunately Tim Day works for the same TSR Enterprises that Mr. Haskins works for.

Kind of strange . . . All of The Paperwork references "TSR Enterprises - Smart Car-Zenn Electric Cars". Todd's business cards say "Smart Car Auto Sales" with no reference to "TSR Enterprises - Smart Car-Zenn Electric Cars" or "ZAP SmartCar".

Really difficult to connect a paper-trail . . . Makes me wonder why.
Hi Everyone

I was wondering if TSR Enterprises and Tim Day was the same dealership. Back on July 2, "Inside Tucson Business" ran an article by Tom Collier, President of the Better Business Bureau of Southern Arizona. Mr. Collier was at the dealership over Memorial Day weekend. Needless to say, it was very informative and not very nice towards the dealership. I tried to link it so everyone could read the article but and I wasn't able to...

Just to give you an idea...

"If BS were music, the salesman who had me in his clutches would have been a brass band"

The article mentions that the vehicles didn't have a window sticker. (Several weeks later, when I went in, all of the Smart fortwos had a "handmade sticker" hanging on every mirror or on the windshied).

The article goes on to mention about warranties, prices, and buyer beware.

Teapots
 

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Discussion Starter #13
TSR Enterprises - SmartCar-Zenn Electric Cars Warning

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" . . . . . . 1) We purchased a 2005 Da Vinci SmartCar form TSR Enterprises on May 31, 2007. Were provided a \"Plate Affidavit\" (Dealer Plate) with a Temporary Plate No. 090606S this Smart Car(VIN No. WME4503321J244186). This Temporary Plate expired July 15th, 2007. While the Temporary Plate expired we still have not received the new registration, license plate or tabs. We no longer can legally drive our SmartCar.

A query to ADOT/DMV result in TSR being contacted and quired as to the status of the paperwork. As of July 27th, 2007 they had not started processing the paperwork. We will be without this car for close to three weeks. (Update: Permanent AZ license plate, title and registration received by FedEx late in the afternoon Tuesday, July 31st) . . . . . .

All other issues remain status quo . . . . . But I have to say things are slowly getting better. Now if he could just come up with that spare key, I would be a happy camper.
 

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Glad to here you can drive your car legally again.
(we didn't really think you'd let it sit in your driveway and not drive it for 3 weeks! ;) )
 

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Discussion Starter #15
This should be my last update: Our Da Vinci is at TSR. It has been there since yesterday, Wednesday, August 15th,

They said that they had to have the car overnight so they could work with SmartCar in France and the time change dictated that they call them from a local (Mesa) Mercedes dealer and SmartCar France would somehow program the chip in the spare SmartCar key-fob, and then the Mercedes dealer would cut the key.

With any luck, this could be (hopefully) our last post-sale problem, except for not receiving a copy of the warranty, which they say is coming every day.:(

One last "Stranger Than Fiction" anecdote . . . While waiting for the dealer loaner car, I noticed an exceptional Mercedes sedan in the back lot. No signs, not price . . nothing to indicate that it was for sale.

Well I walked out to look at it, and was amazed to find it to be a AMG CLK55 . . Titanium Black, black leather upholstery, and all of the interior bells and whistles. When the TSR employee came out to put dealers plates on the loaner, I asked him if it was for sale, and he applied in the affirmative. I asked what they would take for it, and he gave me a very low-ball price. I asked him to conform the sales price and call me, if it was even close, I would buy it.

Well, either the salesman absolutely did not know what he was talking about and he wasn't even close in his estimate, or they are doing such drop-dead business that they don't need additional sales (Note: Only one employee and zero customers in the building at the time) that no one has bothered to call me. What strange ways of doing business???:confused:
 

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Discussion Starter #17
OK,

Something doesn't add up: SmartCar ForTwo, CLK55 .. same buyer. Care to explain? :confused::D
And just why do I owe you or anyone else an explanation about anything I buy or own?

In addition to the SmartCar, our Lincoln Cartier "L' I also have a 80' Vette, with a bored and stroked Moroso 318 CI, 425 HP engine . . . . Never claimed to be an environmentalist Greenie . . . We buy what we like.

If this confuses you, than you must have a very simple life. :rolleyes:
 

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Smart as a second (third?) car? Live and let live...

Many of our buyers are indeed car enthusiasts and a number of them have interesting "others" in their mini-fleets. Our third buyer in May, 2006, is a great 75 year old guy with two other cars in his garage. One is a beautiful black wooden stake truck from the twenties. The other? Well, the bumper sticker on his smart says accurately "My other car is a Hummer".

A more recent buyer has a number of very fancy and expensive vehicles, but his favorite had been his Aston Martin. A classic. He loved driving the Aston because of all the attention it got. He called two weeks after buying his smart. Ecstatically, he said the smart got four times the attention that his Aston ever got.

As we tell our potential customers, people buy cars for many reasons. Some buy for style, some buy for gas economy, some comfort, some price, some dependability and some safety... and any combination of those priorities. It's very complicated. None of us can tell anyone else why they should or shouldn't buy... anymore than we should tell them they belong to the "wrong" religion (shudder).

When folks tell us they want a smart car for the gas economy, we tell them to buy a Yaris or Fit if they are ONLY interested in the economy. Much better values for the miles/gallon. When they say they are interested in the economy AND the looks, we tell them to wait for the 2008's rather than the more expensive Mercedes engine smarts. If they say they feel the quality of the Mercedes engine is what they want, we ask them if they know how many Mitsubishi engines they could buy with the savings over ours. If they say their wife saw the originals in Europe and she ONLY wants that original, we don't screw around with that... just make them aware of the price differential and make sure they know it. When Momma's not happy, ain't nobody happy.

The key here is to respect the decision of each buyer and understand that a car is a very personal purchase. We can't, and shouldn't, get into the heads of other buyers and question their motives. Not other smart owners. Not Hummer owners. Not bicyclists. Life's too short. Enjoy the ride. Hope it's a smart. I think you'll enjoy it most.

Ron Gaus, aSmartCar.com
 

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And just why do I owe you or anyone else an explanation about anything I buy or own?
:
Not trying to pass judgement or offend. I've had my share of muscle cars, tuners, trucks, luxury cars, and race cars, but I usually go through phases. Wouldn't occur to me to drive around in the Isetta one day and to slide over into the GT500 the same day. Truly curious about the mind set.
 
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