[hms6744]

I've noticed somewhat recently that my 2010 smart has been vibrating while idling.
I recently had the ball joint serviced which was not the issue of the vibration.
The check engine light has been coming on randomly, when i took it in to get serviced the mechanic ran the codes and pulled up a few misfire codes, a rough road detection code and the too rich at idle code which has been coming up frequently. I was told they couldn't figure out from a first look at what was wrong with it, and to wait and see if it would come on again, and if any weird symptoms popped up.

The car will vibrate at weird intervals, none of which are severe, but are noticeable. It does't noticeably vibrate while I'm driving, just when idling. Sometimes it will vibrate less than other times. I can describe it as if I was to put a bag on the passenger seat I can see it vibrating slightly.

I cannot remember if this was an issue before the engine light epidemic thats been going on. Is it normal for a smart to vibrate somewhat? It feels unusual, but I don't know if thats my paranoia talking or not :frump:

 

[jwight]

If you are getting misfire codes have them do a leak down check for bad valve(s).

 

[jimvw57]

Sounds very familiar. could be a worn plug, leaking coil, leaking valve, head gasket, .... the list goes on and on. if the code comes up as P0300 or p0301 - P0303 that would be a misfire on a cylinder.

I would start with changing spark plugs, then if it comes up with one code in particular, maybe change the coil for that cylinder. Or swap with another cylinder and see if the code changes to that cylinder.

We have seen some help by adding Marvel Mystery Oil to the gas and sometimes that clears things up too. Mine seemed to get better after I changed out the exhaust as the flex pipe was cracked and started to get noisy, but eventually I lost a cylinder (after 146,000 miles) and sold it to someone who was able to work on it more than I could.

Keep a list of what codes you are getting as that could help find the problem.

 

[jetfuel]

...KISS....air filter?...front mount?...

Jetfuel...next...

 

[jimvw57]

...KISS....air filter?...front mount?...

Jetfuel...next...

Always a good place to start!

 

[BUBBIE]

New here but have a reply

I'm more into Harley...

I suspect in your 2010 a Bad Spark-plug wire or the spark Plug... Also? Would a compression test be easy enough?
That would show you the Compression and easy to see IF that One cylinder is LOW...

I have not done much but Looking into that Tight motor area YET...

IF running Smooth at a Fast Idle, with No Power loss, I would not think the worst YET...

I just bought a 2010 and I too wondered about my Idle...
No Vibration but just Wondered "Is This the correct sound?"
Unusual is best I can describe it. Might be the converter?

MAN, These Smart Cars ARE Smart...

KISS is a good thing here... Keep It Simple ...
Not finishing that saying tho...LOL

Trying to Learn from others on this forum. AND Help when possible..

signed....BUBBIE

 

[chieftmc]

Doubt it's a spark plug wire since the smart has COPs

 

[jimvw57]

I have had cops that have a rough idle until they warm up, and then work fine. They usually get worse until they quit working all together

 

[BUBBIE]

Learning....

Told a while back I haven't looked much but the books that came with my 2010... Need to Study this car...:shrug::RS-c.gl.zw:

Still could be like said above COP OR the wire hook up on that coil to plug... COP Loose or corroded or the plug... LOL If it has one...

I best get a look at that unit. Not finding much here on the forum but one picture of it in the car n motor, showing wires to the coil top...

Maybe a Mod can point me the right direction...

Signed....BUBBIE

This is Good Stuff I found here... http://www.smartcarofamerica.com/forums/gtsearch.php?q=COPS spark plug

 

[jimvw57]

Picture from a post by saronian back in 2011 shows using a 1/4 drive ratchet and 10mm socket to remove the bolt that holds the coil in position. Be careful not to drop the bolt as you will probably never find it. When I changed plugs, I never removed the connectors.

 

[jimvw57]

It would be good to know if you are getting error codes and what they are to help you pin down your problem. Otherwise you could be throwing a lot of parts and time in the wrong direction.

 

[hms6744]

I've included an image of the invoice they gave me that gives a description of all the codes.
The light has not come on again, but the vibration still continues. I notice that sometimes it will start roughly after leaving it overnight or not starting it for a while. The spark plugs were something I had in mind when trying to process what could be the issue. The car also sort of shakes while idling? It vibrates but also does this thing at some lights I stop at where it feels similar if there was a super strong wind blowing against the car making it shake.

 

[Rustedwrench]

I've included an image of the invoice they gave me that gives a description of all the codes.
The light has not come on again, but the vibration still continues. I notice that sometimes it will start roughly after leaving it overnight or not starting it for a while. The spark plugs were something I had in mind when trying to process what could be the issue. The car also sort of shakes while idling? It vibrates but also does this thing at some lights I stop at where it feels similar if there was a super strong wind blowing against the car making it shake.

The reason the shop can not tell you what is wrong is because there are too many codes and they don't point to a specific part they can sell you. Why people continue to frequent these shops is beyond my ability to comprehend. Probably because they have a low labor rate. This is what you get with a low labor rate.

Anyway, what I would do is first look at freeze frame data for each fault code to see at what mileage it was set, which can be done with a proper scan tool in the hands of somebody who knows what they are doing. The next thing is clear the fault codes and see which ones return and in what order.

I would also drive the car and look at fuel trim data to see what the fuel trims are at idle, under load and at light-throttle cruise speed. That gives one a big clue as to what is going on. That is done with a proper scan tool graphing the live data.

Look at the fault codes. The crankshaft position sensor is used for misfire detection and detection. It is also used as a real-time input for fuel injection timing and ignition timing. If the crankshaft position sensor was dead the car would not start. If the signal from the sensor is erratic that could cause some of the other faults including rough running. The signal from the sensor can be monitored with a oscilloscope to determine signal integrity.

The other thing is the rich at idle fault code. A rich condition at idle will cause a rough idle due to full or partial misfires. Now why would one get a rich at idle condition? One answer is the engine is getting un-metered fuel from somewhere. The most obvious place is from a stuck open or leaking purge valve. If it does not seal when closed it will allow fuel vapors from the charcoal cannister to be drawn into the engine in a greater volume than desired and that would be most evident at idle, which is when you have the least air flow.

One has to think about how all these things work together. Many theoretical mechanics can not do that because they don't really know how things work. They diagnose based on, "The last time I saw this it was that." Or the shop does not charge for diagnosis. If they don't charge for it all you will get is codes and guesses.

You can not properly diagnose anything based on fault codes alone. That can get you a lot of new parts you don't need and if they are aftermarket electrical or electronic parts they are probably worse than the ones on the car now.

The auto repair industry is in a sorry state overall and that is perpetuated by people who keep the low-rent shops in business. I fell bad for anyone who can not work on their own vehicle.

 

[Bence1991]

I've noticed somewhat recently that my 2010 smart has been vibrating while idling.
I recently had the ball joint serviced which was not the issue of the vibration.
The check engine light has been coming on randomly, when i took it in to get serviced the mechanic ran the codes and pulled up a few misfire codes, a rough road detection code and the too rich at idle code which has been coming up frequently. I was told they couldn't figure out from a first look at what was wrong with it, and to wait and see if it would come on again, and if any weird symptoms popped up.

The car will vibrate at weird intervals, none of which are severe, but are noticeable. It does't noticeably vibrate while I'm driving, just when idling. Sometimes it will vibrate less than other times. I can describe it as if I was to put a bag on the passenger seat I can see it vibrating slightly.

I cannot remember if this was an issue before the engine light epidemic thats been going on. Is it normal for a smart to vibrate somewhat? It feels unusual, but I don't know if thats my paranoia talking or not :frump:

I have had cops that have a rough idle until they warm up, and then work fine. They usually get worse until they quit working all together

I had similar symptoms.The valve guides were worn and after changing them, all those vibrations and faults codes disappeared. I was checking the spark plugs, ignitions coils, injectors, cylinder pressure, engine air inlet filter...those were all okay. My car had approx 93000km in when symptoms came.