I sure do agree with you!!! No matter what lane you are in, if the folks in the lanes to your right are passing you, either speed up, or move to a slower lane.
What cracks me up are folks who use the car pool lane, and they are going slower than the traffic in the other lanes, LOL. Kinda defeats the purpose of the carpool lane...

Best Regards,
Nu

 

So if you are breaking the law, I have to get out of your way?? Why don't you just pass on the right........oh that would be breaking the law

 

"It wasn't me, it wasn't me..." rivate:

 

Dont worry I compensate for that slow poke all the time! I love to see people do a double take when I pass them....

 

There is no where (that I know of) that has those speeds in NJ. I am glad. Some drivers here are nuts and those speeds would just make worse.

 

BWG - though it isn't posted that way, I seem to recall having to drive 80 on the Parkway at rush hour, for fear that I would get a ticket if I didn't keep up. Granted, it has been a few years...

 

You folks have 80 MPH Zones?

No Realy, Whats the speed limit in the carpool lane?

 

Remember, on those turnpikes big brother is watching via EZ-Pass
THey know how long it took from on to off

 

I know. I was confused and went the wrong way; the path was for those who have a smart pass. Unfortunately for my Dad, the van I was driving then was in his name and he got the ticket.

 

Forest, maybe not officially, but when tens of thousands of your best friends surrounding you are all going the same speed, there's not much chance of ticket. You don't have to worry about speeders, they have no lane open to cut into. BTW, when I was a very young guy going to Las Vegas, there was no speed limit on the highway in NV (before freeways, and not so many travelers). The big boomers were Caddies, Buick (straight 8's,) Packards and other 6 ton sleds. I doubt if many of those tanks could hit 100, but they all tried...

 

When last we wandered through Oklahoma, the turnpikes had speed limits of 75 mph. The regular interstates in New Mexico up around Santa Fe were posted with an 85 mph limit back in the early years of this decade. And, Montana still has (I believe) no limit during daylight other than "reasonable and prudent".

The de facto limit on open area interstates here in Texas is just under 80 MPH. Similarly, the turnpike limits in Oklahoma are just a hair under 85 MPH, and the locals out in New Mexico were blowing by us like we were standing still when we were set right at the legal limit.

We've not yet had our Smart up above 70 MPH, not having made any lengthy trips in same since we got it a week or so ago. We'll not likely be doing any high speed runs until after we get a working Smartmadness-sourced cruise control, but the car certainly feels stable at the speed limit.

 

And, Montana still has (I believe) no limit during daylight other than "reasonable and prudent".

Not any more. The Interstate speed limit for cars in Montana was set at 75mph* about ten years ago.


*Except for the urban areas around Missoula, Billings, and Great Falls, where it's 65.

 

I just discovered today that my Nav unit keeps a record of my vehicle's maxium speed (until reset). At the same time, I discovered the maximum speed I've driven my smart, as determined by GPS. 90.4 MPH. For shame!

 

I TOPPED IT OUT @ 92 GETTING AWAY FROM A CRAZY WOMAN IN A MUSTANG TRYING TO TALK MY PICTURE WITH HER PHONE AND DRIVING AT THE SAME TIME SHE WAS GOING FOR A CLOSE UP AND COMING INTO MY LANE.

 

Terry, you're going to love the smartmadness cruise control...

 

I already have, to a limited extent. When I installed it, the cruise system apparently worked just fine. However, the engine/transmission was apparently thrown into "limp home mode" (apparent, since I only did a self-diagnosis) and the vehicle would not get above 50 MPH while it remained installed.

Within those limits, the cruise worked wonderfully. I had not yet installed the LED where it was easily seen, so I had to rely on a relay of the signals from my lovely wife, who was never quite sure of what color it was showing. But, all seemed to run well.

The original unit has been returned to SmartMadness (and should reach there today), and I hope to have a new one by the middle of next week.

On the minus side, I've already been into and out of the area below the dash two times now - a lot of contortions for no visible end result at this point. On the plus side, I've already been into and out of the area below the dash two times now - valuable experience for when I put it in (and, hopefully, leave it in) the next time.

I have to admit that the way[/i] that the unit installed was wonderful. The Smart is my second experience with a "fly by wire" vehicle (our Scion xB is that way to a limited extent), but the first upon which I have attempted some serious modifications. This business of pulling out a plug, seating a new plug, and then cleaning your hands is a lot easier than all of the grief that we went through with welding and tapping and rewiring with earlier cruise controls.

It's a brave new automotive world...

 

I Love living in this fantasy land where the speed limit is 65MPH on on the interstate and 55 on the Highways and you can go that speed with plenty of company. If you want to go faster their is usualy plenty of room to do that as well.:burnout: Watch for the speed traps


Looking at a lot of the Speeds on this thread, No wonder so many folks complain they are not getting the same MPG others can. You don't have to be a Hypermiler, You just have to live where shaving 5 min off your commute doesn't have to translate to cutting 5 off your MPG as well.
Not to mention time off your life

Slow down folks,
Life shouldn't be a race to the Finish :badidea:

 

...Slow down folks,
Life shouldn't be a race to the Finish :badidea:

I must agree Forest....

It's the journey that matters, NOT the destination

 

"the smartmadness cruise control"

Congrats to Boris and the team for making this product their own in the minds of some SCOA customers!

The customer service is certainly top notch.

 

You leave me completely confused, orangandblack. I can't tell if you're agreeing with me or mocking me.

 

that's cause i'm from jersey and we only care about getting from point a to point b and the hell with anybody that gets in our way, and then we wonder why we pay the highest insurance rates. lol

 

I thot the same thing, orangeandblack

 

It wasn't me, Burt. Mine is white...

 

Depending what state you're in, Rigger. From an accident perspective, absolutely. In a state with "slower traffic keep right except to pass" style laws, it's unlawful to hang out further left when there's room right.


Someone going the "speed limit" in the left lane isn't being "lawful" but "righteous."

 

There are two issues here, the speed-limit and the real-world flow of majority traffic or as the engineering surveyors might put it, 'the 85th percentile'.

When most people are exceeding the speed-limit, it probably means the speed limits are too low (the freeway is a good example, and this assumes free-flowing condition, not stop and go traffic, since engineering surveys are done in free-flowing conditions).

One issue is that those who take the speed limit seriously in spite of real-world conditions will create a hazard if they park it in the fast lane at 70 mph (aka the number 1 lane). Those wanting to go with the flow of traffic (usually around 80+ in LA in free-flowing conditions) will simply pass the slow car on the right if the car doesn't yield in time. Since most people won't yield, and when there's an obstruction or a blockage, the slow driver now becomes an obstacle in a slalom course.

This means more lane-changes, greater speed disparity and you guessed it, more accidents.

The reason Germany enjoys higher speeds and lower accidents per mile isn't just about enforcement of speed but enforcement of lane-discipline by drivers and the law. Pass on the left and if you're not passing you're not in the fast lane, and it's strictly enforced and reinforced. It's also encouraged that people be out of the way of faster traffic *before* they're up your exhaust.

Americans who laze away in the fast lane slower than the flow of traffic may be somewhat obeying the speed limit, but they're putting themselves and others at risk and damaging the efficiency of the road they're on. This contributes to road-rage and more reckless lane-changes in many cases. In other words, the person 'obeying the speed limit' in the number 1 lane is not innocent and is often the cause of the frustration and more numerous lane-changes by anyone who comes up on them from behind.

Another angle here is that engineering and traffic surveys are designed not just for the slowest speed, but a speed which reflects the 85th percentile, because generally, the bulk of traffic won't go faster than is warranted by conditions.

There will be flagrant speeders and slowpokes, but the 85th percentile rule is used in America and all the states to determine speed limits on non-freeway highways and streets. Trouble is, the 85th percentile on freeways in free-flowing conditions is most certainly not 65mph, thus making most freeways into big speed-traps and confusing the slowpokes and justifying their pokey driving.

It's a mixed message, fast traffic, slow limits and often, enthusiastic enforcement=horribly sloppy drivers with no lane discipline and thus, more accidents and frustration for everyone.

 

NukleoN, thats the best explanation I've seen yet. I wish the CHP would enforce this more effectively. Also, I don't understand why tour busses, large cube/moving vans, etc use the car pool lanes. They may eventually get up to reasonable speeds, but give them a slope to climb and they fall on their face and really impede traffic.

 

That's like saying it is alright to run over a pedestrian just because he isn't crossing at the cross-walk. Or it's okay to run a red light because everyone else is doing it.
The keep right except to pass is posted on the assumption that that the person you are trying to pass is below the speed limit. It doesn't say it's okay to speed and pass??

 

That's like saying it is alright to run over a pedestrian just because he isn't crossing at the cross-walk. Or it's okay to run a red light because everyone else is doing it.
The keep right except to pass is posted on the assumption that that the person you are trying to pass is below the speed limit. It doesn't say it's okay to speed and pass??

Running a red light is illegal, period. There might be ultra-rare exceptions, but a red light cannot be run through without committing a serious and expensive infraction. This is not a question of anarchy, but speed laws and how they work in the U.S., and comparisons to other countries who enjoy higher speeds and fewer accidents per mile. That is to say, in Germany drivers are better-trained, better disciplined, driver *faster* than us on average and get in *fewer* accidents. There's something to be learned here.

The speed of traffic is not like a red light, because the 'safe' speed depends on conditions and flow of traffic. Traffic speed laws on surface streets and highways in fact are *determined* by traffic flow, not the other way around.

The penalty for a failed red-light stop is a catastrophic broadside with another vehicle. The penalty for going faster or slower on the freeway is you end up having to brake or accelerate...and there's some risk associated with lane-changes as mentioned in my prior post.

The real-world flow of traffic is not determined by law but by the majority who vote with their right foot, based on conditions, how safe people feel in their cars (IE: Modern technology vs. say, a 1974 Honda CVCC), the roads, etc.

If you read my post, speed limits are determined on surface streets not by judges or cops, but by traffic engineers who go to the streets and measure, under free-flowing conditions, the 85th percentile traffic speed, not on a curve or under the influence of a traffic control device (signal or stop sign).

This measurement is the basis of the speed limit and must be within 5mph, usually rounded up but sometimes rounded down. The MUTCD (Manual for Uniform Traffic Control Devices) is the federal guideline for the U.S. and all states must be in majority compliance. This prevents serious issues which would arise if states could set a super low speed-limit on a given street, ticket everyone they can stop and make a ton of money for the city. There's a reason the federal guideline is in place.

Now, the freeway is not subject to an engineering survey, though states can set their own maximum limits as we've seen with Montana's open 'reasonable and prudent' speeds, where they've not suffered any rise in accidents since people won't necessarily go 120mph just because they can. This 'reasonable and prudent' rule of thumb on freeways is precisely what I was talking about in my prior post, that is, we should apply the Basic Speed Law to freeways and stop pretending 65mph has any relevance. Other states have elected to have 80mph speed limits, or 70mph as I've seen in CA on certain stretches. With a simple Basic Speed Law applied to freeways, a person going 60 in the fast lane is charged with 'unsafe for conditions'. Same with the person crossing into the carpool lane over the double yellow, or the guy doing 90 in the slow lanes or anywhere, based on the cop's discretion.

That said, conditions have a lot to do with speed limits and what is safe. If it's raining, going the speed limit may still be unsafe under the basic speed law, and an officer may stop you to slow you down. Likewise, it shouldn't be deemed *unsafe* when it's 4a and you're doing 80 on an empty 4 lane freeway (assuming a sober driver, all things being equal). However, this is left up to the discretion of the officer, but any guilty finding over '65 mph' where posted is an infraction, and you will pay for it.

A red light is not negotiable except in extreme cases...and even then you'd put others in direct risk of an instant collision if you blow a red light at the wrong time. Meanwhile, traffic flowing in the *same direction* is not a threat to you, as long as you don't have great speed disparity. If everyone on the freeway was going 50, then yes, 80 would be unsafe but you could always brake and would have plenty of warning. If everyone is going 80, then 65 is unsafe in anywhere but the rightmost (slow) lanes with the trucks. See the difference?

See if you can answer this question correctly:

The safe speed to merge onto a freeway, according to the DMV is:

1. At or below the speed limit
2. The flow of traffic

If you answered 2., 'Flow of traffic', then you're correct. *This is in the pool of California licensing questions*.

Now, given this logic, if we are to MERGE at flow-of-traffic, why is it then illegal to DRIVE at flow when it's faster than the posted limit? Answer: It shouldn't be, and that's the point. The flow of traffic is the safest speed you can drive at, with speeds varying by lane choice (or at least that's how it should be).

It's always good to learn from other social experiments, as I think our traffic laws, namely speed laws, could use some upgrading. We should be taking cues from countries like Germany with regard to driver-training and lane-discipline.

 

Don't you have that flipped, orngandblack? What I was suggesting was that just because someone isn't crossing at the crosswalk doesn't mean it's okay to run over him.

If you're at a 4-way stop and clearly got there first and it's apparent the driver that arrived later is going first, do you yield even though you have the right of way? Of course you do!

The issue is with the person hanging out in the left lane going slower than other traffic. Even if they are going the speed limit, they are obstructing the flow of traffic. The speeder doesn't have the right to exceed the speed limit either, accepted. But it doesn't justify the "slowpoke" obstructing the flow of traffic just as driving the speed limit in the left lane doesn't justify speeding.

Rights tend to be valid only until they infringe upon the rights of other.

 

The issue is the person being upset that someone is doing the speed limit.
You are only obstructing a the traffic that is attempting to break the law. You do not have a right to break the law.
At a 4 way if I am there first I will not yield to someone who tries to go first without a controled near miss on my part.

Like I said the left lane is for passing, as long as you can do it within the speed limit. The original post states that the person is doing 70, that's a little bit faster than "hangin in the lane" would suggest.

 

nonsense. its all nonsense