BbB-What is your theory on the causes?
-sun
-elements/rain
Would garaging really help?
Did you apply cleaners?
What replacement options are there? $?

 

Honestly, I'm thinking UV rays is the cause of it. I don't think cleaners would make a difference as the hairline cracks are INSIDE the roof. Not on the inside or the outside. My dad's Passion is always kept in the shade or carport and the roof still looks like new. We picked his up last July 4th. My roof had started crazing after about 8 months.

 

I sure would be interested to hear from other in the sun belt who don't garage their cars how common this is as oposed to those that keep it in the shade or under a Cal Pop top when in the sun.
I think you should spend the bucks on one of those tops as a preventitive measue just in case, especialy if you might need to sell one of those cars.
http://www.capoptop.com/purchase.htm

Oh, and for those that may be putting a shade between the sunscreen and the roof, You may be adding heat to the Bayer Policarb and potentialy making the issue worse.

 

If that is a manufacturer defect I don't know what is as they the roof shouldn't be cracking in a year. I will raise hell to smart if mine does this as I put my money in the car expecting quality.

 

roof replaced at 6000k



I live in NJ roof started to craze at only 6000k and my fabulous dealer(Benzel Busch)
replaced it right away. This is product defect and Smart should stand behind thier product way after a warranty of the car is up. Smart better get it together and let these great little cars succeed. There is no excuse for all the the complaints of various kinds. The bad press and them not addressing it can make all of us lose our investment.

 

FWIW, mine still looks like new but I'm up here in NJ. The car is not garaged except for occasional weekends but is covered at night. During the day, it sits in the full sun at work. (I picked it up May 1st and it's been my daily driver since then.)

 

Crazing is indeed a small series of flaws in the chemical soup that makes the clear roof. Since the roof is part of the structural integrity of the car for passenger safety I would certainly be challenging smart (MB) about your future wellbeing.

To be sure, it would require independent testing (read expensive) to be positive, but since this is "just" out of warranty I would be threatening them that IF they don't replace it and you have an accident, your lawyer will be advising your estate that the weakened roof was the cause of your demise...... squeeky wheels and lawyer threats are the best way to get action these days with the diarrhea of law school grads being puked out today.

 

You do make a good point Russ........good food for thought. We're heading down to the Old Town meet in a few weeks and I have to get the 2.0 upgrade so I may show it to them then. Other than that, I haven't complained about it at all to anyone....until I mentioned it in this thread.

 

...aircraft windows are exposed to heavy doses of UV rays at altitude, carbon residues from other jets just sitting on the tarmac and the condition you describe only had but one solution...replacement...today this windows made out of many materials like Monolithic acrylic ,Laminated acrylic ,Acrylic/Glass laminates and Glass/Glass laminates can be restored/recondition to like new conditions by many processes....the company we use, Perkins Aircraft Windows, does a hell of a job for us and if you ever see this work being done you'll tell yourself "it will never be the same"...the whole process start with sanding up from 180 grit, which makes the plastic totally milky white, using a jitter bug sander, working your way up to 6k and even 10k grit, finish the whole thing with an anti-static coating and protective wax..
...can it be done on the smart?...I don't see why not...my 1c

jetfuel

 

AHHHH....maybe that's my problem. At work I do park my car about 400 yards away from running aircraft.....maybe it's the propwash and not the UV rays.

I would think that this would be something that Smart would do if my eyes are playing tricks on me and it is actually on the upper layer of the roof. That being said, I could do the same myself.....might have some access to the items you just mentioned.

 

Largest Roof Module Made of Polycarbonate - ATZ online

Info on the roof. ^^^

The 450's had a glas roof that came with a diferent set of problems and added weight.

 

I wish the '08's would have had the '09 steel option, I'd have paid extra not to have the heat, scratches and potential failures after extended time, plus a thickness that would give space for real insulation.

 

There is no steel option
karl

 

Alan remember I asked Dave S. about the roof thing. My whole roof is now spider webed.

 

Alan remember I asked Dave S. about the roof thing and he said that was a great question and wanted all my info but never got back to me on the subject. My whole roof is now spider webed.

AHHH, I got it mixed up. I thought he addressed it before you mentioned it. Well then, time for Sunbelt people to stand up and speak out if we're having problems. I do love the panoramic roof - don't get me wrong. It's one of many unique things that make the car what it is....UNIQUE.

 

...not prop wash per say....but the fumes/exhaust/carbon emission of a prop jet/jet engine is worst than any acid rain you will ever encounter...and if it sits on the roof and your car gets morning dew it will more than accelerate the problem...
..BBB try this...after work run a white towel over one of the corners of the roof and see what color it comes back to....

jetfuel

 

For what it's worth (probably not much), some of the plastic safety guards on a machine I operate exhibit crazing. I'm not sure what type of plastic they're made of ... looks like plexiglas to me. The machine is six years old and hasn't seen the light of day since it was installed... any UV it has been exposed to might be from fluorescent lighting. I doubt that's s significant source of UV. The crazing is most obvious along corners, where the plastic was formed ... maybe by heating. So, there are other causes. Stress, changes in temperature, who knows what else?

 

...NCC...what's that plastic expose to?...cutting oils/chemicals/

jetfuel

 

...NCC...what's that plastic expose to?...cutting oils/chemicals/

Paper dust, vibration, mild cleansers. The equipment it houses uses grease and light oil but it is very uncommon for those lubricants to come into contact with the guards.

Question for Bumb-Bling: Is the crazing uniform across the roof, or more pronounced in certain areas?

 

Ah, you poor Floridians... Now your pano roofs are looking just like those middle-aged women on the beach!




Seriously - sounds bad.

My smart is 14 months old, garaged at night, out in full overcast by day and no crazing.

 

Ah, you poor Floridians... Now your pano roofs are looking just like those middle-aged women on the beach!

...ouch.....

jetfuel

 

I'm Orange County California and have this around the edges of the Smarts Roof. It sits in the sun all day everyday unless of course its raining. I'll wait until it gets worse before having it replaced.

 

I've got something that I thought was scratching from dust at interstate speeds, but if that were the case, I'd see scratches on the rest of the body. I have my car detailed professionally - never through a machine. The guy knows the top is plastic and as such did not apply sealant to it, but I'm not sure if it gets waxed... I'll have to ask him again. I don't see spider webs but I see streaks that may be the start of micro cracks about an inch or two through the front edge, and then little bits here and there around the whole roof if the light hits it just right.

I love the car, and if this is a structural safety issue it needs to be addressed soon. If it's just cosmetic, I'll need some expert instruction on how to keep it from getting worse. Either way, I think there's a 60% chance I'll be discussing it with the dealer as a warranty item within the next 10 months.

My car sits outside, not garaged. I have kept a sun shade between the normal shade and the 'glass', on the hottest days. Didn't consider heat buildup would cause damage, but maybe. If anything I think the problem was more noticeable after the super cold 15 degree days... maybe the heat/cold variance was too much flex for the plastic? A couple of days we had 20 degree lows followed by 60-70 degree highs. If the cause were pure cold, we'd hear about this from up north.

 

bzzzzz wrong

i work at the Airport

we have also just had a very hot summer with temps up to 120deg car never garaged 12months old and no issue at all!

not getting crazy at all!

 

Cal Pop Tops are great Got mine !!

 

No crazing yet though the belly pan came off on the right side.They broke some clips at the dealer so they fixed that. The black plastic around the hatch looks awfull,like someone took sandpaper to it.Now I'll have to have that fixed.BB the filler primer worked nicely,but I'm going to get new pieces and do them again because the Krylon over the primer is very fragile.Or just prime them again and use a different type of paint.

 

Knew that was going to happen to the clear roofs. I would have figured having crazing when the car was 5-6 old. You see it on older car head lights too. Florida sun, and salt, is just hard on cars. Mines prefect 8 months, garage at night, and in the day time, at work.
Paint the roof, and put in a pop up sun roof, that would look really cool. Put in 2 and side ways, and make t-tops.

 

The term for this is called crystalizing and it starts in the front and takes over the whole roof mine was a little spot at first then it took over. I have heard of about 10 people with this problem.

 

Yes yes, mine started in the front too and is gradually moving to the back! Which does make me think it has something to do with wind.

 

I once built a body of lexan and the front was stressed (bent).
The sign painter came in and wiped it with (NO- acetone) Tuolene and it started crazing.
They were small cracks in the plastic.

 

Randy....acetone will ....

I once built a body of lexan and the front was stressed (bent).
The sign painter came in and wiped it with acetone and it started crazing.
They were small cracks in the plastic.

IMMEDIATELY craze polycarbonate plastic (PC--Lexan is same product with a brand name attached to it) but can be used as an adhesive on acrylic plastic. I have not experienced any crazing on my roof as yet and I have one of the first cars (1174). Car is garage kept, however.

John

 

I'm very curious. Could somebody take a picture?

 

Pics of mine are coming up

Not to bolster the controversy but my car was parked at least 5 days of the week directly adjacent to the Santa Monica Airport where the Airplanes often taxi and wait, the air quality is often very bad and often made me nauseous even while inside a building.

 

Stress?
One thing that hasn't really been discussed is whether the temperature changes could be causing pressure to build and stress the roof. I've seen (and commented on) the nearly air tight nature of the cabin - how many times have you had to slam the door a second or third time to get it completely closed? If you're in a sunny, hot climate, could the internal temperature of the cabin when the car is parked cause the air inside to expand and exert pressure which exhibits evidence of itself in the weakest structure it finds? I hear about folks in Arizona laughing at the tourists who close the windows of their rental cars completely when they park them. They talk about walking out into the parking lot at midday and listening to the pops of those rental cars' windows blowing out. Imagine that the pressure builds and is released, builds and releases time and again as the car sits in the direct sun day after day. Eventually, that flexing (though very minor) begins to show up as some of the other examples have indicated, at a stress point like the plastic guards that craze at a point where they have a bend.

On a more practical note, did you mention this and point it out to your dealer when you were still under warranty, and can you document that? If so, you can demonstrate it was a problem while the car was still under warranty and you might make your case for a replacement. The thing to check is, did they note on a work order to check the roof for the scratches or cracks. If it's on the work order and the date/mileage are within the warranty period, start "squeaking." Unfortunately, claiming you verbally told them to check it and they dismissed the problem probably won't stand up unless your dealer's shop wants to be a "nice guy" and go the extra mile for you by fixing it and fighting their own battle with corporate. (Went through this with a radio in a Toyota 15 years ago and the dealer wouldn't go to bat for me. Never went back, even when I was in the market for a new Toyota, so they lost a $20,000 future sale for what was probably a $60 replacement radio.)